2023-10-17 Interactive Brokers Group, Inc. (IBKR) Q3 2023 Earnings Call Transcript
Company Participants 公司参与者
Nancy Stuebe - Director, IR
南希·斯图比 - 主管，投资关系
Paul Brody - CFO 保罗·布罗迪 - 首席财务官
Thomas Peterffy - Chairman
托马斯·彼得菲 - 主席
Milan Galik - President, CEO & Director
米兰·加利克 - 总裁、首席执行官及董事
Conference Call Participants
会议电话参与者
Craig Siegenthaler - Bank of America
克雷格·西根塔勒 - 美国银行
Benjamin Budish - Barclays
本杰明·布迪什 - 巴克莱
Patrick Moley - Piper Sandler
帕特里克·莫利 - 派珀·桑德勒
Brennan Hawken - UBS 布伦南·霍肯 - 瑞银
Daniel Fannon - Jefferies
丹尼尔·法农 - 杰富瑞
Chris Allen - Citi 克里斯·艾伦 - 花旗
James Yaro - Goldman Sachs
詹姆斯·亚罗 - 高盛
Kyle Voigt - KBW 凯尔·沃伊特 - KBW
(Transcript provided to Seeking Alpha by the company.)
（公司提供给 Seeking Alpha 的文字记录。）
Operator 操作员
Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Interactive Brokers Group Third Quarter 2023 Earnings Call. [Operator Instructions] I would now like to turn the conference over to your speaker for today, Nancy Stuebe. Please go ahead.
您好，感谢您的耐心等待。欢迎参加互动经纪集团 2023 年第三季度财报电话会议。[操作员指示] 现在我将会议交给今天的发言人南希·斯图比。请继续。
Nancy Stuebe 南希·斯图贝
Good afternoon, and thank you for joining us for our third quarter 2023 earnings conference call. Once again, Thomas is on the call, but asked me to present his comments on the business. Also joining us today are Milan Galik, our CEO, and Paul Brody, our CFO. After prepared remarks, we will have a Q&A.
下午好，感谢您参加我们 2023 年第三季度的财报电话会议。再次提醒，托马斯在电话中，但请我代他发表对业务的评论。今天还与我们一起的是我们的首席执行官米兰·加利克和首席财务官保罗·布罗迪。在准备好的发言后，我们将进行问答环节。
As a reminder, today's call may include forward-looking statements, which represent the company's belief regarding future events, which by their nature, are not certain and are outside of the company's control. Our actual results and financial condition may differ, possibly materially, from what is indicated in these forward-looking statements. We ask that you refer to the disclaimers in our press release. You should also review a description of risk factors contained in our financial reports filed with the SEC.
作为提醒，今天的电话会议可能包含前瞻性声明，这些声明代表了公司对未来事件的信念，这些事件本质上是不确定的，并且超出了公司的控制范围。我们的实际结果和财务状况可能与这些前瞻性声明中所指示的内容存在重大差异。我们请您参考我们新闻稿中的免责声明。您还应查看我们向证券交易委员会提交的财务报告中包含的风险因素描述。
Our robust operating metrics once again translated into strong financial results this quarter. Our account growth remained strong at 21%, while our client equity was up 29%. Net interest income reached a record, as did our total adjusted net revenues, which were over $1 billion for the third consecutive quarter. On the other hand, markets were down in nearly every country in the quarter, and trading volumes dropped. Low market volatility, customers moving to higher-priced stocks of companies with greater capitalization and overwhelming competitive strength, and a geopolitical environment that is increasingly uncertain, all led to lower DARTs. This meant that while we were able to increase our commission revenue slightly, reaching its fourth highest level in our history, it is still the case that investors are holding onto the same seven equities and not trading others actively. However, options volumes continue to be strong and option commissions were up the most this quarter, then came futures, while stock commission revenue dropped.
我们的强劲运营指标再次转化为本季度的强劲财务业绩。我们的账户增长保持在 21%的强劲水平，而客户权益增长了 29%。净利息收入创下纪录，我们的总调整净收入也创下纪录，连续第三个季度超过 10 亿美元。另一方面，本季度几乎所有国家的市场都下跌，交易量下降。低市场波动性、客户转向市值更大、竞争力更强的高价股票，以及日益不确定的地缘政治环境，导致 DARTs 下降。这意味着尽管我们能够略微增加佣金收入，达到历史第四高水平，但投资者仍然持有同样的七只股票，而没有积极交易其他股票。然而，期权交易量依然强劲，本季度期权佣金增长最多，其次是期货，而股票佣金收入则下降。
As I’ve said previously, I do not expect this situation to reverse. There are several competing cross-currents in the markets. If you are a long-term investor, and looking 10 years out, what you want most is stability, and not to lose a lot of money. You want to put your assets in a politically, currency- and inflation-wise stable place. While historically that has been the US, the US will look less stable politically as the election approaches, and inflation will look worse because of wage increases and union issues as well as the increasing cost of carrying US government debt. As apparent US political stability weakens, people are less likely to invest in equities.
正如我之前所说，我不认为这种情况会逆转。市场上存在几种相互竞争的潮流。如果你是一个长期投资者，并且展望 10 年后，你最想要的是稳定，而不是损失大量资金。你希望将资产放在一个政治、货币和通货膨胀方面都稳定的地方。虽然历史上美国一直是这样的地方，但随着选举的临近，美国在政治上看起来会变得不那么稳定，通货膨胀也会因为工资上涨、工会问题以及持有美国政府债务的成本增加而变得更糟。随着美国政治稳定性的明显减弱，人们投资股票的可能性也会降低。
On the other hand, there is the tax liability for US taxpayers on substantially appreciated stock prices, should that gain be realized. This background explains what we have been seeing lately in the markets. Our customers’ top stock holdings, the Magnificent Seven, hasn’t changed much but corresponding options activity has increased. In addition, we are seeing more and more investors getting into US treasuries.
另一方面，对于美国纳税人来说，如果实现了大幅上涨的股票价格，就会产生税务责任。这一背景解释了我们最近在市场上看到的情况。我们的客户主要持有的股票，即“七大巨头”，变化不大，但相应的期权活动却增加了。此外，我们看到越来越多的投资者开始投资美国国债。
Generally, activity on our government and corporate bond platform has picked up appreciably. We do not see inflation coming down substantially, and still see interest rates staying at elevated levels for a long time, which will in turn increase spending to pay the interest on this debt, adding to inflationary pressures. It remains the case that investors globally are looking to the markets to stay ahead of inflation and uncertainty. More people want to invest in securities markets, hold their choice of currency in their accounts, and gain exposure to different countries, particularly the US, as a way to build wealth and security.
一般来说，我们的政府和企业债券平台的活动显著增加。我们不认为通货膨胀会大幅下降，并且仍然认为利率将在较高水平上维持很长时间，这反过来会增加支付这笔债务利息的支出，从而加大通货膨胀压力。全球投资者仍在寻求通过市场来应对通货膨胀和不确定性。越来越多的人希望投资于证券市场，在他们的账户中持有自己选择的货币，并获得对不同国家的敞口，特别是美国，以此作为积累财富和保障的方式。
We continue to advertise, and closely watch which outlets work the best for us. We have built an automated advertising system, where we measure the yield and use an algorithm to adjust spending on each channel where we advertise. Telling everyone about our 4.83% return on immediately available qualified cash may have prevented withdrawals but it barely helped to increase customer cash which grew only by a little more than 2% from the prior year.
我们继续进行广告宣传，并密切关注哪些渠道对我们最有效。我们建立了一个自动化广告系统，通过测量收益并使用算法调整每个广告渠道的支出。告知大家我们 4.83%的可立即使用的合格现金回报率可能阻止了提款，但几乎没有帮助增加客户现金，客户现金仅比去年增长了略超过 2%。
In terms of our client segments, our strongest ones for account growth have been individuals and proprietary traders, which have also shown the strongest growth in 12-month commission revenue, while financial advisors, individuals and introducing brokers have seen the strongest growth in net interest income. Geographically, Europe has seen the fastest account growth, followed by Asia, then the Americas.
在我们的客户细分中，账户增长最强的群体是个人和自营交易者，这两个群体在过去 12 个月的佣金收入中也显示出最强的增长，而金融顾问、个人和介绍经纪人则在净利息收入方面表现出最强的增长。从地域上看，欧洲的账户增长最快，其次是亚洲，然后是美洲。
I would like to talk about our introducing broker segment. I spoke of two large accounts coming. I regret that now, because the timing of these accounts is out of our control and with the larger of the two, it is difficult to put an exact time on it. But we have so much else going on, that I feel it is a disservice to focus only on “When? When? When?” for this 1 client, when we have so many other promising items lined up. First, the smaller of the two i-brokers successfully began onboarding their approximately 52,000 accounts; so far more than half of them are with us, and we expect the bulk of the rest by the end of the year.
我想谈谈我们的引介经纪人部分。我提到有两个大账户即将到来。我现在对此感到遗憾，因为这些账户的时机不在我们的控制之中，而对于其中较大的一个，确实很难确定确切的时间。但我们还有很多其他事情在进行中，我觉得只关注这个客户的“什么时候？什么时候？什么时候？”是不公平的，因为我们还有许多其他有前景的项目在排队。首先，较小的那家引介经纪人成功开始了大约 52,000 个账户的入驻；到目前为止，其中超过一半的账户已经与我们合作，我们预计其余的大部分将在年底之前完成。
Next, a couple of other introducing brokers are joining us. All this is to say – when that “other” i-broker starts to onboard, I will let you know. Until then, I cannot put a date on it – I have been wrong on the date for a while now, so it is unclear to me why you would want me to keep giving one! But unfortunately, it is not only the date I have been wrong on. I have also misestimated the size of these operations. They now, both appear to be smaller than I originally expected and accordingly, I need to reduce my estimate of long term account growth from 30% to the low 20% area.
接下来，还有其他几位介绍经纪人加入我们。总之，当那个“其他”的介绍经纪人开始入驻时，我会通知你。在那之前，我无法给出具体日期——我在日期上已经错了很久，所以我不明白你为什么还希望我继续给出一个！但不幸的是，我不仅在日期上出错。我对这些业务的规模也估计错误。现在，它们似乎都比我最初预期的要小，因此，我需要将长期账户增长的估计从 30%降低到低 20%的范围。
On the hedge fund side, the most recent Preqin statistics show us moving into the number 5 position in terms of number of hedge funds for which we serve as prime broker. We were once again the fastest-growing of the top prime brokers this year. We plan to be #4 next year, behind only Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley, and JP Morgan. Our developers have been extremely busy with new products and tools, and have a full plate for the remainder of the year.
在对冲基金方面，最新的 Preqin 统计数据显示，我们在担任主要经纪人的对冲基金数量上已跃升至第五位。今年我们再次成为顶级主要经纪人中增长最快的公司。我们计划明年排名第四，仅次于高盛、摩根士丹利和 JP 摩根。我们的开发人员一直忙于新产品和工具，接下来的一年还有很多工作要做。
This quarter, we: Introduced fractional shares trading for Canadian stocks and ETFs; Launched a Securities Lending dashboard for our more sophisticated clients to be able to assess short selling activity for specific securities and inform their decision-making; Introduced the next-generation IBKR Desktop trading platform; Launched the “Discover” tool, to help clients find opportunities based on their own customized settings and trading preferences; Started our “Cents of Security” podcast, designed to help improve financial literacy for newer investors; and Introduced long-term investment accounts in Hungary.
本季度，我们：为加拿大股票和 ETF 推出了分数股交易；为我们的更高级客户推出了证券借贷仪表板，以便评估特定证券的卖空活动并帮助他们做出决策；推出了下一代 IBKR 桌面交易平台；推出了“发现”工具，帮助客户根据自己的定制设置和交易偏好寻找机会；启动了我们的“安全分”播客，旨在帮助提高新投资者的金融素养；并在匈牙利推出了长期投资账户。
We remain very optimistic about what our business model – international market access, a strong and secure balance sheet, and multiple features and tools, all at low prices with high interest paid on cash balances – offers to clients and potential clients around the world. In an increasingly uncertain world, the greater degrees of freedom our clients have to manage their portfolios as they wish, the better their ability to educate themselves as events change and economies increasingly fluctuate and diverge, the better off they will be. With that, I will turn the call over to our CFO, Paul Brody, who will go through the numbers for the quarter. Paul?
我们对我们的商业模式持非常乐观的态度——国际市场准入、强大而安全的资产负债表，以及多种功能和工具，所有这些都以低价格提供，并对现金余额支付高利息——为全球客户和潜在客户所提供的机会。在一个日益不确定的世界中，我们的客户在管理投资组合时拥有的自由度越大，他们在事件变化和经济波动加剧时自我教育的能力就越强，他们的处境就会越好。接下来，我将把电话交给我们的首席财务官保罗·布罗迪，他将介绍本季度的数字。保罗？
Paul Brody 保罗·布罗迪
Welcome, everyone, to the call. As usual, starting with our Revenue items on page 3 of the release, we followed on our strong first and second quarter performances with net revenues reaching over $1.1 billion. With ongoing customer account and balance sheet growth, we continue to build a strong base for revenue growth in the future. Commissions were $333 million, up 4% from the year-ago quarter despite industry-wide declines in equities volume. Our options volumes, in particular, came in at a quarterly high, doubling the pace of industry volume growth. Stock share volumes declined from last year’s quarter, once again driven by a drop in trading of lower-priced stocks, but also reflective of lower industry volumes.
欢迎大家参加电话会议。和往常一样，我们从发布的第 3 页的收入项目开始，我们在第一和第二季度的强劲表现基础上，净收入超过了 11 亿美元。随着客户账户和资产负债表的持续增长，我们继续为未来的收入增长奠定坚实基础。佣金为 3.33 亿美元，比去年同期增长了 4%，尽管整个行业的股票交易量下降。我们的期权交易量尤其达到了季度新高，增长速度是行业交易量增长的两倍。股票交易量较去年同期下降，这再次是由于低价股票交易的减少，同时也反映了行业交易量的下降。
Net interest income was a quarterly record $733 million, reflecting higher interest on margin loans and segregated cash. These gains were partially offset by the higher interest we paid on customer credit balances, as our longstanding policy is to pass through rate hikes above 50 basis points to our customers on their qualified funds. Other fees and services generated $52 million, with the biggest contributors being market data fee revenue of $17 million, risk exposure fee revenue of $13 million, and options exchange liquidity payments of $8 million. The $8 million overall increase in risk exposure fees from the prior year quarter was driven by more risk-on positioning of customers.
净利息收入创下季度记录，达到 7.33 亿美元，反映了保证金贷款和隔离现金的利息上升。这些收益部分被我们支付给客户信用余额的更高利息所抵消，因为我们长期以来的政策是将超过 50 个基点的利率上调转嫁给客户的合格资金。其他费用和服务产生了 5200 万美元的收入，其中市场数据费用收入为 1700 万美元，风险敞口费用收入为 1300 万美元，期权交易所流动性支付为 800 万美元。与去年同期相比，风险敞口费用整体增加 800 万美元，主要是由于客户的风险偏好增加。
Other income was $27 million and includes gains and losses on our investments, our currency diversification strategy and principal transactions. Note that many of these non-core items are excluded in our adjusted earnings, and without these excluded items, Other income was $20 million for the quarter.
其他收入为 2700 万美元，包括我们投资的收益和损失、我们的货币多样化策略以及本金交易。请注意，许多这些非核心项目在我们的调整后收益中被排除，排除这些项目后，其他收入在本季度为 2000 万美元。
Turning to expenses, Execution, Clearing & Distribution costs rose 14% versus last year, led by higher volumes in options, which carry higher fees than equities. We measure the profitability of our commissions by looking at Gross Transactional Profit, which is Commission revenue less Execution & Clearing costs. This measure excludes market data expense, which is a pass-through. In the third quarter, Execution & Clearing costs were 23% of commission revenue, for a Gross Transactional Profit margin of 77%.
在费用方面，执行、清算和分配成本比去年增长了 14%，主要是由于期权交易量增加，期权的费用高于股票。我们通过查看毛交易利润来衡量佣金的盈利能力，毛交易利润是佣金收入减去执行和清算成本。该指标不包括市场数据费用，因为这是一个过账费用。在第三季度，执行和清算成本占佣金收入的 23%，毛交易利润率为 77%。
Compensation & Benefits expense rose 14% over the prior year quarter, on a combination of a 5% increase in average headcount and also on inflation. Compensation & Benefits expense was 11% of our adjusted Net Revenues, versus 13% last year, and below its historical level. Our headcount at quarter-end was 2,927. G&A expenses returned to a more typical level this quarter after we recorded a reserve in the second quarter for regulatory matters, which have since been settled.
补偿和福利费用比去年同期增长了 14%，这主要是由于平均员工人数增加了 5%以及通货膨胀的影响。补偿和福利费用占我们调整后净收入的 11%，而去年为 13%，低于历史水平。季度末我们的员工人数为 2,927。由于我们在第二季度为监管事务记录了准备金，这些事务现已解决，本季度一般和行政费用回到了更典型的水平。
Versus the prior year-quarter, increases were related to advertising and legal expenses, partially offset by a reduction in consulting fees. Our adjusted pretax margin was 73%, up from 68% in the year-ago quarter. Income tax expense of $68 million reflects the sum of the public company’s $36 million and the operating companies’ $32 million.
与去年同期相比，增加的费用与广告和法律费用有关，部分被咨询费用的减少所抵消。我们的调整前税利润率为 73%，高于去年同期的 68%。6800 万美元的所得税费用反映了上市公司 3600 万美元和运营公司 3200 万美元的总和。
Moving to our balance sheet on page 5 of our release, our total assets were $121 billion at the end of the quarter, with growth over last year driven primarily by increases in our margin lending and securities lending businesses. We maintain a balance sheet aimed at supporting our growing businesses and providing ample financial resources during volatile markets, with maximum flexibility and short-term liquidity. We have no long-term debt and the duration of our U.S. investment portfolio at September 30th was 26 days.
在我们发布的第 5 页的资产负债表中，截至本季度末，我们的总资产为 1210 亿美元，较去年增长主要得益于我们的保证金贷款和证券借贷业务的增加。我们保持一个旨在支持我们不断增长的业务并在波动市场中提供充足财务资源的资产负债表，具有最大的灵活性和短期流动性。我们没有长期债务，截至 9 月 30th，我们美国投资组合的久期为 26 天。
In our operating data, on pages 6 and 7, our contract volumes for all customers were strong, with options reaching their highest quarterly level, up 18% from a year ago. Futures contract volumes were down slightly, in line with industry volumes. And in stocks, the drop off of 22% was largely attributable to investors moving to higher quality stocks, as trading in pink sheet and other very low-priced stocks declined the most.
在我们的运营数据中，第 6 页和第 7 页显示，所有客户的合同交易量都很强劲，期权达到了最高的季度水平，比去年增长了 18%。期货合同交易量略有下降，与行业交易量一致。在股票方面，22%的下降主要归因于投资者转向更高质量的股票，因为粉单和其他非常低价股票的交易量下降幅度最大。
On page 7, you can see that our account growth remains robust, with over 140,000 net account adds in the quarter and total accounts at 2.4 million, up 21% over the prior year. Total Customer DARTs were 1.9 million trades per day, down slightly from the prior-year quarter.
在第 7 页，您可以看到我们的账户增长保持强劲，本季度新增净账户超过 140,000 个，总账户达到 240 万个，比去年增长 21%。每日客户交易量（DARTs）为 190 万笔，较去年同期略有下降。
Our Cleared IBKR Pro Customers paid an average of $3.11 Commission per Cleared Commissionable Order, up 5% from last year as our clients’ volume mix included higher per order contributions from options and futures. Page 8 presents our Net Interest Margin numbers. Total GAAP net interest income rose 55% to $733 million from the year-ago quarter, reflecting stronger earnings on segregated cash and margin loans, partially offset by higher interest expense on customer cash balances. With one more 25 basis point hike in the latest quarter, the average Federal funds rate was over 300 basis points higher this year than last.
我们的清算 IBKR Pro 客户每个清算可收取佣金的订单平均支付了 3.11 美元的佣金，比去年增长了 5%，因为我们的客户交易量组合中包含了来自期权和期货的更高每订单贡献。第 8 页展示了我们的净利息差数据。总的 GAAP 净利息收入从去年同期的 4.73 亿美元上升了 55%，达到了 7.33 亿美元，反映出隔离现金和保证金贷款的收益更强，但部分被客户现金余额的利息支出上升所抵消。在最新季度再加息 25 个基点后，平均联邦基金利率比去年高出 300 个基点以上。
Many other central banks also raised rates this quarter. This group includes the UK, Canada, Hong Kong and the Eurozone. Net interest earned on segregated cash was $728 million, up $500 million from last year, primarily from global rate hikes. Maintaining a short duration on our invested funds continued to allow us to closely match asset and liability maturities and pick up benchmark rate increases quickly.
许多其他中央银行在本季度也提高了利率。这个群体包括英国、加拿大、香港和欧元区。隔离现金的净利息收入为 7.28 亿美元，比去年增加了 5 亿美元，主要来自全球利率上升。保持我们投资资金的短期到期使我们能够紧密匹配资产和负债的到期，并迅速获得基准利率的上调。
As I said, at September 30th, our US portfolio duration was 26 days, so the investments have rolled over into new, higher rates with a fairly short lag time. A 5% increase over the year ago quarter in average segregated cash and securities balances also helped drive interest income higher. Margin loan interest rose to $623 million, nearly doubling the prior year quarter, despite average margin loan balances rising only slightly. Higher rates, in the US and internationally, have driven higher margin interest income.
正如我所说，截至 9 月 30 日，我们的美国投资组合久期为 26 天，因此投资已经转入新的、更高的利率，滞后时间相对较短。与去年同期相比，平均隔离现金和证券余额增加了 5%，这也推动了利息收入的增长。尽管平均保证金贷款余额仅略有上升，保证金贷款利息却上升至 6.23 亿美元，几乎是去年同期的两倍。美国和国际上的高利率推动了更高的保证金利息收入。
Securities lending net interest was $66 million, down from the year-ago quarter due both to lighter overall demand for so-called “hard-to-borrow” stocks, and to a rate dynamic we have noted previously: namely, as benchmark rates rise, a greater portion of the revenue generated by lending securities, for which we receive cash collateral that we invest as segregated funds, is categorized as interest on Segregated Cash. We estimate this impact to be about $28 million for the quarter vs last year. In other words, without this shift in reporting line items, net interest from securities lending would have been $94 million, versus $114 million in the year-ago quarter.
证券借贷净利息为 6600 万美元，较去年同期下降，这既是由于对所谓“难以借入”股票的整体需求减弱，也与我们之前提到的利率动态有关：即基准利率上升后，借贷证券所产生的收入中，作为现金抵押的部分被我们投资为隔离资金的比例更大，因此被归类为隔离现金的利息。我们估计这一影响在本季度约为 2800 万美元，而去年同期为 6600 万美元。换句话说，如果没有这一报告项目的变化，证券借贷的净利息将为 9400 万美元，而去年同期为 1.14 亿美元。
Interest on Customer Credit Balances, or the interest we pay our customers, grew as higher rates in many currencies led to our paying interest on qualifying balances as we pass through rate increases. We paid $832 million to our customers on their balances in the third quarter. Fully rate sensitive balances were up about 5% from the second quarter, at $21 billion. We consider our policy offering clients a full pass-through of all rate hikes after the first 50 basis points on their qualified cash a significant component in our success, and one that continues to set us apart.
客户信用余额的利息，或我们支付给客户的利息，随着多种货币利率的上升而增长，因为我们在利率上升时对符合条件的余额支付利息。我们在第三季度向客户支付了 8.32 亿美元的余额利息。完全利率敏感的余额比第二季度增长了约 5%，达 210 亿美元。我们认为，向客户提供在符合条件的现金上，首次 50 个基点后的所有利率上涨的全额传递政策是我们成功的重要组成部分，并且这一点使我们与众不同。
We believe this leads to clients choosing to keep their cash with us, especially active clients who do not want to use sweep programs that prevent them from immediately accessing their cash to invest.
我们相信这导致客户选择将现金存放在我们这里，特别是那些不想使用限制他们立即访问现金以进行投资的自动转账计划的活跃客户。
Now, for our estimates of the impact of increases in rates—increases and decreases. Given market expectations of near-term rate hikes and further out rate reductions, we estimate the effects of both increases and decreases in the Fed Funds rate on our net interest income. We estimate increases in the Fed Funds rate to produce additional annual net interest income of approximately $56 million for each 25 basis point increase in the benchmark. Symmetrically, decreases in the Fed Funds rate should reduce annual net interest income by approximately $56 million for each 25 basis point decrease in the benchmark.
现在，对于我们对利率上升的影响的估计——上升和下降。考虑到市场对近期加息和未来降息的预期，我们估计联邦基金利率的上升和下降对我们的净利息收入的影响。我们估计，联邦基金利率的每次 25 个基点的上升将产生大约 5600 万美元的额外年净利息收入。对称地，联邦基金利率的每次 25 个基点的下降应减少大约 5600 万美元的年净利息收入。
Note that our starting point for these estimates is September 30th, with the Fed Funds effective rate at 5.33%, and based on balances at that date. About 25% of our customer cash balances is not in US dollars, so estimates of US rate change effects exclude those currencies. We estimate increases in all the relevant non-USD benchmark rates to produce additional annual net interest income of approximately $20 million for each 25 basis point increase in the benchmarks.
请注意，我们这些估计的起点是 9 月 30 日，联邦基金有效利率为 5.33%，并基于该日期的余额。大约 25%的客户现金余额不是以美元计价，因此对美国利率变化影响的估计不包括这些货币。我们估计，所有相关的非美元基准利率的增加将为每 25 个基点的基准增加大约 2000 万美元的年净利息收入。
In conclusion, the company performed well in the third quarter in a complex and uncertain environment, reflecting our continued ability to grow our customer base and deliver our core services to customers, at low costs and competitive interest rates, as we manage the business effectively with strong controls over risk and operating expenses.
总之，在复杂和不确定的环境中，公司在第三季度表现良好，反映了我们持续扩大客户基础和以低成本及具有竞争力的利率向客户提供核心服务的能力，同时我们有效管理业务，对风险和运营费用进行严格控制。
And with that, we will turn it over to our moderator and happy to take questions.
那么，我们将把时间交给我们的主持人，欢迎提问。
Question-and-Answer Session
问答环节
Operator 操作员
[Operator Instructions] Our first question today will be coming from Craig Siegenthaler of Bank of America.
[操作员指示] 我们今天的第一个问题将来自美国银行的克雷格·西根塔勒。
Craig Siegenthaler 克雷格·西根塔勒
With equity now over $13 billion, we wanted to get your updated thoughts on the potential usage for deployments, either returning capital to shareholders via a dividend increase or special dividend or even through M&A. And I think you just talked up the prospects of M&A at a competitor conference last month. So maybe refresh us on that topic, please.
随着股本超过 130 亿美元，我们想了解您对潜在用途的最新看法，包括通过增加股息或特别股息向股东返还资本，甚至通过并购。我想您上个月在竞争对手会议上刚刚谈到了并购的前景。请您再给我们更新一下这个话题。
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
So we have looked at 2 specific opportunities, neither one of them have worked out. They wanted a higher price than—no, actually, in one case, the target wanted more than we were willing to pay. And in the other case, they were not interested in doing anything. And since they have very strong voting power, there is nothing we can do. But we keep on looking. So if anybody hears of anything, please let us know.
我们已经关注了两个具体的机会，但都没有成功。他们想要的价格比我们愿意支付的要高——实际上，在一个案例中，目标方想要的价格超过了我们的出价。而在另一个案例中，他们对任何事情都不感兴趣。由于他们拥有很强的投票权，我们无能为力。但我们会继续寻找。如果有人听说了什么，请告诉我们。
Craig Siegenthaler 克雷格·西根塔勒
And Thomas, also on the dividend, too, please.
还有托马斯，也请算上股息。
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
We are not looking to increase the dividend. We are looking to increase the amount of money we have because it gives us greater— it gives our clients a greater sense of security. And as you have heard, we are hoping to get larger and larger investors to come with us and that security cushion is very important to them, especially since we are not a systematically important counterparty.
我们并不打算增加股息。我们希望增加我们的资金量，因为这能给我们和我们的客户带来更大的安全感。正如你所听到的，我们希望吸引越来越大的投资者与我们合作，而这种安全缓冲对他们来说非常重要，尤其是因为我们不是一个系统重要的对手方。
Craig Siegenthaler 克雷格·西根塔勒
Great. And I think, Thomas, do I get a follow-up? Or is it just one?
很好。我想问一下，托马斯，我会有后续吗？还是只有一次？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
As far as I'm concerned, go ahead.
就我而言，随便。
Craig Siegenthaler 克雷格·西根塔勒
All right. Great. So my second one is on the expense side. Employee comp and benefits down about $9 million sequentially. So any comment on that? And is this a good run rate to work on for next quarter? And I think you also consolidated some European offices in the quarter. So, I don't know if that benefited this quarter or if that's going to benefit a future quarter?
好的。很好。那么我的第二个问题是关于支出方面的。员工薪酬和福利环比下降了大约 900 万美元。对此有什么评论吗？这是下个季度的一个良好运行率吗？我还认为你们在本季度合并了一些欧洲办公室。所以，我不知道这是否对本季度有利，还是会对未来的季度有利？
Paul Brody 保罗·布罗迪
Right. So Craig, we mentioned last quarter that there was an odd accounting requirement that we measure vacation days taken by employees around the world every quarter. And we accrue them at a certain rate, and then we subtract the days taken, and we have to take an expense for the difference. That tends to build up in the second quarter and then go back down in the third quarter as people take vacation over the summer. It only seems obvious to many of us. We have— so that unfortunately generates a little bit of quarter-to-quarter noise.
好的。克雷格，我们在上个季度提到过，有一个奇怪的会计要求，我们需要每个季度衡量全球员工的休假天数。我们以一定的比例进行计提，然后减去已休的天数，对于差额我们必须计入费用。这在第二季度往往会累积，然后在第三季度随着人们在夏季休假而回落。这对我们许多人来说似乎是显而易见的。不幸的是，这会产生一些季度间的噪音。
We've done some research into this and determined that we can measure this annually instead of quarterly. Sort of anticipating that it does go up and down and employees do, in fact, take their vacations annually. And by the end of the year, it's mostly even again. So we're going to adopt that next year, starting with 2024 and you should stop seeing the quarter-to-quarter variations. And that accounted for $4-$5 million of the change upside and then downside— upside in the second quarter, downside in the third quarter.
我们对此进行了研究，确定可以每年而不是每季度进行测量。我们预期这会有波动，员工确实每年会休假。到年底时，情况基本上又会平衡。因此，我们将从 2024 年开始采用这种方法，您应该不再看到季度之间的变化。这导致了 400 万到 500 万美元的变化，上升是在第二季度，下降是在第三季度。
As far as consolidating offices or rather merging operations in Europe, we would not expect that to have a material impact. It's primarily driven by our desire to simplify our regulatory environment by having 1 regulator instead of 2, not driven by rationalizing the staff, as they say.
关于在欧洲合并办公室或合并运营，我们不认为这会产生实质性的影响。这主要是出于我们希望通过拥有一个监管机构而不是两个来简化我们的监管环境，而不是出于精简员工的考虑。
Milan Galik 米兰·加利克
Let me clarify that a little bit. So your question was whether we are already seeing the benefits in the numbers of the consolidation. And the answer to that is no. The migration of the accounts to our Irish entity, as well as consolidation of the 2 entities into 1, is going to take anywhere between 6 and 9 months. At first, we are going to see a restructuring charge as we migrate the accounts to Ireland.
让我稍微澄清一下。你的问题是我们是否已经在合并的数字中看到了好处。答案是否定的。将账户迁移到我们的爱尔兰实体，以及将两个实体合并为一个，将需要 6 到 9 个月的时间。起初，我们会看到一个重组费用，因为我们将账户迁移到爱尔兰。
We're going to be paying into an insurance fund. But after that, we are expecting to see the benefit of $7 million or so dollars per year that is direct cost savings aside from reduced distraction that we have to suffer because we have to pay attention to 2 European entities as opposed to 1. So the $7 million is a direct benefit, plus there are significant benefits by reducing the distraction and being able to focus on fewer entities.
我们将向一个保险基金支付费用。但在那之后，我们预计每年将看到大约 700 万美元的收益，这是一种直接的成本节省，此外，我们还减少了因需要关注两个欧洲实体而产生的干扰。因此，这 700 万美元是直接收益，加上通过减少干扰并能够专注于更少的实体所带来的显著好处。
Operator 操作员
And our next question will be coming from Benjamin Budish of Barclays.
我们的下一个问题来自巴克莱的本杰明·布迪什。
Ben Budish 本·布迪什
Thomas, I wanted to ask if you could maybe clarify the sort of long-term account guidance you talked about. I think earlier last month at a presentation, you talked about sort of moving away from the 30% target to like a 20% plus. I'm just wondering how much of today's commentary is different from that? Is it sort of because you have less clarity around the timing of the i-broker accounts that you talked about before? Or is it sort of more of a material change in your longer-term outlook?
托马斯，我想问一下你能否澄清一下你所提到的长期账户指导。我记得上个月早些时候在一次演讲中，你提到过从 30%的目标转向 20%以上。我只是想知道今天的评论与之前的有什么不同？是因为你对之前提到的 i-broker 账户的时间安排不太清楚吗？还是说这更多是你长期展望的实质性变化？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
Well, no. I mean what happened was that initially, when these 2 introducing brokers came on the scene, I thought that they were both having more customers than they, in fact, do and that is aside of the fact that it is extremely cumbersome and a lengthy process to onboard the second one. Generally, I thought I went too far in guessing and saying, yes, I think that it's going to be 30%.
好吧，不。我是说，最初，当这两个介绍经纪人出现时，我认为他们的客户比实际要多，这还不算上引入第二个经纪人是一个极其繁琐且漫长的过程。一般来说，我觉得我在猜测时走得太远了，并说，是的，我认为这将是 30%。
I just have to come back and hands up to— that now I realize that I really don't know. I mean the fact is that we don't see into the future, and there is no big clock out there that tells me what it's going to be, right? So it remains a guess, but I think that I'd rather give you a more conservative guess, and I'm comfortable with 20%, 22%, 23%, 24%, maybe even 25%, but somewhere in the 20% to 25% range, I feel more comfortable.
我只需要回来，举手——现在我意识到我真的不知道。我的意思是，事实是我们无法预见未来，外面没有一个大钟告诉我将会发生什么，对吧？所以这仍然是一个猜测，但我认为我宁愿给你一个更保守的猜测，我对 20%、22%、23%、24%甚至 25%感到更舒服，但在 20%到 25%的范围内，我觉得更自在。
Ben Budish 本·布迪什
Got it. Well, I really appreciate the candor there. Maybe a follow-up on the options activity. Just curious if you can give any more color on like what the breakout of that is? Is it more opportunity outside the U.S.? Is it the shorter dated pieces? Is it your hedge fund clients or the retail clients? What are the key drivers of that? And just thinking about as we have kind of seen options activity grow over the last several years. How much more room do you think there is to go kind of based on all those pieces that you see?
明白了。我非常感谢你的坦诚。也许可以跟进一下期权活动。我很好奇你能否提供更多关于这方面的信息？是美国以外的机会更多吗？还是短期的部分？是你的对冲基金客户还是零售客户？这些的关键驱动因素是什么？考虑到我们在过去几年中看到期权活动的增长，你认为基于你看到的所有这些因素，还有多少增长空间？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
So I think that options activity has a tremendous future because what has been going on in the United States, as you well know, is generally followed by other places around the world with a lag of 10, 20, 30 years. And so we see more and more interest outside of the United States, and we also—there is now options trading overnight.
我认为期权活动有着巨大的未来，因为在美国发生的事情，正如你所知道的，通常会在全球其他地方滞后 10、20、30 年。因此，我们看到越来越多的国际兴趣，此外，现在也有期权交易在夜间进行。
So it's basically 24 hours a day, even though overnight, is still very little volume, but it's catching on. And I see a world in 5 to 10 years from now when options volume will be the same 24 hours, no matter what time of the day you're looking at it. And it is also true that, yes, short-term dated options, the larger—the largest volume is in zero day options. And that's just what's happening.
所以基本上是全天 24 小时，尽管过夜时的交易量仍然很少，但它正在逐渐流行。我看到在未来 5 到 10 年，期权交易量将全天 24 小时保持一致，无论你在什么时间查看。而且确实如此，短期到期的期权中，最大的交易量是在零天期权。这就是目前的情况。
Operator 操作员
And our next question will be coming from Patrick Moley of Piper Sandler.
我们的下一个问题将来自 Piper Sandler 的 Patrick Moley。
Patrick Moley 帕特里克·莫利
Congrats on a strong quarter. So maybe just diving back into Ben's question. Can you maybe
恭喜你们取得了强劲的季度业绩。那么也许可以回到本的问题上。你能否再说一下？
hammer in on the trend you're seeing in the 0DTE piece and maybe the flow buildout...
在你看到的 0DTE 部分上强调趋势，也许还有流动性扩展……
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
Hold it. Please, hold it. We do not understand your words. So it comes across very garbled. Could you please move whatever you're talking into further away from yourself?
等一下。请，等一下。我们听不懂你的话。所以听起来非常混乱。你能把你说的东西移得离自己远一点吗？
Patrick Moley 帕特里克·莫利
Yes, sure. So just was hoping we could maybe dive back into the 0DTE piece. Can you talk a little bit more about the breakout that you're seeing there, the flow between institutional and retail and the sustainability there and maybe what it means for growth going forward.
是的，当然可以。我只是希望我们能回到 0DTE 的部分。你能多谈谈你看到的突破吗，机构和零售之间的流动，以及那里的可持续性，可能对未来的增长意味着什么。
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
Well, between institutional and retail, I never quite understood how to categorize something into institutional versus retail. So when the account is opened in the name of an entity rather than a person, we call that institutional. Now as you know, introducing brokers are entities. So even though there are individuals at the other end of the process, so I cannot tell you the breakout between what's institutional, and what's retail. But there are certainly many, many trading shops that I assume basically are institutional who trade a lot of options.
好吧，在机构和零售之间，我从来没有完全理解如何将某些东西分类为机构或零售。因此，当账户以实体的名义而不是个人的名义开设时，我们称之为机构。正如你所知道的，介绍经纪人是实体。因此，即使在流程的另一端有个人，我也无法告诉你机构和零售之间的区分。但我可以肯定地说，有很多我认为基本上是机构的交易商，他们交易大量的期权。
Milan Galik 米兰·加利克
Maybe I can give you a little bit of color. Perhaps it's going to be helpful. The way we participate, and our customers participate in these zero-day options— expiring options - is that we often send the customer orders into price improvement auctions. Now that requires that we first find liquidity for the customer’s order from one of the market makers, one of the institutions that we are connected to. So a lot of the trading we do in these zero-day options, we have an institution on one side and a customer on the other side. It's not obviously 100% of the volume, but it's quite a bit of it. So in short, it's mixed participation.
也许我可以给你一些背景信息。也许这会有所帮助。我们参与这些零日期权的方式，以及我们的客户参与这些即将到期的期权，是我们经常将客户订单发送到价格改善拍卖中。这需要我们首先从我们连接的市场做市商或机构中为客户的订单找到流动性。因此，我们在这些零日期权中的交易，往往一边是机构，另一边是客户。虽然这并不是 100%的交易量，但占了相当一部分。简而言之，这是一种混合参与。
Operator 操作员
Our next question today will be coming from Brennan Hawken of UBS.
我们今天的下一个问题将来自瑞银的布伦南·霍肯。
Brennan Hawken 布伦南·霍肯
I'd actually like to follow up on that 0DTE and try and get some color from a different perspective. You mentioned that it was a material part of the option volume. Could you give some more specific color around what proportion 0DTE represents today versus maybe a year ago? And when you think about...
我实际上想跟进一下 0DTE，并尝试从不同的角度获取一些信息。你提到它是期权交易量的重要部分。你能否提供一些更具体的信息，关于今天 0DTE 占比与一年前相比的比例？当你考虑到……
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
We do not measure that.
我们不测量那个。
Brennan Hawken 布伦南·霍肯
Okay. Well, then that's straightforward. Maybe shifting to your perspective, Thomas. When you think about this product and its maturity, what inning do you think we are in its emergence and in its growth?
好的。那么这很简单。也许换个角度来看，托马斯。当你考虑这个产品及其成熟度时，你认为我们处于它的出现和增长的哪个阶段？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
I think it takes— I would guess. Again, I'm just guessing. I mean I don't have anything more than anybody else does. I'm guessing that the relative proportion of zero-date and very short date options is going to probably remain the same, but overall option volume will keep increasing. And I think that it's probably going to increase by 5% to 10% a year going forward indefinitely.
我认为这需要——我会猜测。再说一次，我只是猜测。我是说，我没有比其他人更多的信息。我猜测零日期和非常短期选项的相对比例可能会保持不变，但整体期权交易量将继续增加。我认为未来每年可能会增加 5%到 10%，而且这种趋势将持续下去。
Brennan Hawken 布伦南·霍肯
That's overall option volume?
那是整体的期权交易量吗？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
Yes. 是。
Milan Galik 米兰·加利克
And there is one interesting thing, if I could add. There is one interesting thing happening in Europe. The European exchanges were obviously observing this phenomenon in the United States with envy, and they are going to be listing zero-day options or 5-day options that are listed every day. So every day you will have an expiring option in cash-settled index options, and that's what they really are. So we will see some of the same phenomenon over time outside of the United States.
还有一件有趣的事情，如果我可以补充一下。在欧洲发生了一件有趣的事情。欧洲的交易所显然在羡慕美国的这一现象，他们将会上市零天期期权或每五天上市的期权。因此，每天你都会有一个到期的现金结算指数期权，这就是它们的本质。所以我们将会在美国以外的地方看到一些相同的现象。
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
That is true, but European option volume— option volume on European exchanges is very, very tiny percentage of the total.
这是真的，但欧洲期权的交易量——在欧洲交易所的期权交易量占总量的比例非常非常小。
Milan Galik 米兰·加利克
Indeed. 确实。
Brennan Hawken 布伦南·霍肯
We'll see what envy can get us on that front. I'd like to— and I totally appreciate that this is really sort of challenging to nail down. But when you were answering the prior question about the introducing broker, Thomas, sort of a couple of other questions jump to mind. You mentioned that the— your sense of the size of one of the introducing brokers has changed. It's not as large as you thought. Was that—I was kind of curious about what might cause that. Was that because maybe they aren't growing as fast as you had thought when you initially started to talk to them or that maybe the opportunity set to move a portion of their business over to Interactive is going to be just smaller than you had initially guessed?
我们将看看嫉妒在这方面能给我们带来什么。我想——我完全理解这确实有点难以确定。但是当你回答关于介绍经纪人的前一个问题时，托马斯，脑海中浮现出几个其他问题。你提到过——你对其中一个介绍经纪人的规模的看法发生了变化。它并没有你想象的那么大。我有点好奇是什么导致了这种变化。是因为他们的增长速度可能没有你最初与他们交谈时想象的那么快，还是因为将他们部分业务转移到互动平台的机会可能比你最初猜测的要小？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
To be quite frank, I was so enthusiastic when they first showed up on the scene, I estimated that they would have several million accounts. And now it turns out that they probably have hundreds of thousands of accounts.
坦率地说，当他们首次出现在这个领域时，我非常热情，我估计他们会有几百万个账户。现在看来，他们可能只有几十万个账户。
Milan Galik 米兰·加利克
Well, maybe a little bit different color. So what remains the same is the institution that we're talking about is one of the top multinational banks in the world by assets. So that remains the same. What we have learned recently is that instead of them bringing over a large chunk of the accounts that would be migrated from one broker to another, that's not what we're going to see. We're going to see very little of that. What the hope is, is that a lot of the banking clients of these global institutions are going to become self-directed investors on the platform this bank is integrating with us. So that's what really is changing. They are having hopes of turning their banking clients into brokerage clients.
好吧，也许颜色稍微有点不同。所以不变的是我们所谈论的机构是全球资产排名前列的跨国银行之一。这一点没有改变。我们最近了解到的是，他们并不会将大量账户从一个经纪商迁移到另一个经纪商，我们不会看到太多这样的情况。希望的是，这些全球机构的许多银行客户将成为在这家银行与我们整合的平台上的自我导向投资者。这才是真正的变化。他们希望将银行客户转变为经纪客户。
Operator 操作员
Our next question will be coming from Daniel Fannon of Jefferies.
我们下一个问题将来自 Jefferies 的 Daniel Fannon。
Daniel Fannon 丹尼尔·法农
Another question just on the account growth. I think, Thomas, you mentioned other introducing brokers that have signed up. Could you maybe talk to the discussions and/or the backlog of what might be smaller or the pipeline of how you were thinking about the broader introducing broker opportunity?
另一个关于账户增长的问题。我想，托马斯，你提到过其他已注册的介绍经纪人。你能否谈谈讨论情况和/或可能较小的积压，或者你对更广泛的介绍经纪人机会的思考？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
So there are several banks and brokerage firms around the world that have a relatively small customer base— it doesn't pay for them to develop the technology that's necessary to compete in this world today. So they are relatively easy to get onto our platform. And with our very automated platform, we hope that they will grow very quickly and other firms— other similar firms, seeing their situation, will either come along also or will drop out of the business. That's what I see.
所以世界上有几家银行和经纪公司客户基础相对较小——他们没有足够的动力去开发在今天这个世界中竞争所需的技术。因此，他们相对容易进入我们的平台。凭借我们高度自动化的平台，我们希望他们能够快速成长，而其他公司——其他类似的公司，看到他们的情况，要么也会加入，要么会退出这个行业。这就是我的看法。
Daniel Fannon 丹尼尔·法农
Okay. And then I wanted to follow up on the conversation or topic of M&A. We— you have not been an acquirer previously. So could you talk to what it is you're looking for, how we should think about the return profile or accretion or economic kind of thresholds that you have for doing a transaction?
好的。然后我想跟进关于并购的对话或话题。您之前并没有进行过收购。那么您能谈谈您在寻找什么吗？我们应该如何考虑您在进行交易时的回报特征、增值或经济门槛？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
So we believe that by far, we have the most efficient operation and our technology is by far the best. So it would make sense that other firms that have less—that are less automated – would benefit— I mean their overall daily operation would benefit coming onto our platform. So that would be the basic idea.
所以我们相信，到目前为止，我们的运营效率是最高的，我们的技术也是最好的。因此，其他那些自动化程度较低的公司，使用我们的平台会受益——我的意思是，他们的日常运营整体上会受益。这就是基本的想法。
Milan Galik 米兰·加利克
One additional strength that we have compared to the other players in this space is that we are global in terms of accessing the markets. So when an Asian or European institution integrates with us, they can serve not only access to the U.S. markets, but to their local markets as well.
我们相比于该领域的其他参与者的一个额外优势是，我们在市场接入方面是全球性的。因此，当一个亚洲或欧洲机构与我们整合时，他们不仅可以接入美国市场，还可以接入他们的本地市场。
Daniel Fannon 丹尼尔·法农
And just a follow-up. Is there—from a size or capacity, I mean is there a limit like in terms of what you're looking at? Are these small acquisition— small potential targets? Is it— just trying to get a sense of how big to think about what type of M&A you would be contemplating.
还有一个跟进问题。从规模或容量来看，您在考虑的方面是否有上限？这些是小型收购——小型潜在目标吗？我只是想了解一下您在考虑什么类型的并购时应该考虑多大的规模。
Milan Galik 米兰·加利克
It all depends, right? So what we would obviously be looking at is what is the opportunity. Is it an institution that has relatively little automation and we can jump in and generate a lot of cost savings by automating the operations. Is it a large number of active accounts that they have. It all depends. So when we are presented with an opportunity, we look at the economics.
这完全取决于，对吧？所以我们显然要关注的是机会。是一个相对自动化程度较低的机构，我们可以介入并通过自动化操作产生大量成本节省吗？他们有大量活跃账户吗？这一切都取决于。因此，当我们面临一个机会时，我们会考虑经济因素。
We have usually a couple of ideas of how we would go about the integration. What is it that we would be looking for in the final outcome, and that determines the price we're willing to pay. Unfortunately, in one of the two cases that Thomas mentioned, we were short of the price that the seller was demanding. They haven't sold yet. They may come back to us, but it's unclear whether they will.
我们通常有几个关于如何进行整合的想法。我们在最终结果中希望看到什么，这决定了我们愿意支付的价格。不幸的是，在托马斯提到的两个案例中，我们的报价低于卖方的要求。他们还没有出售。也许他们会回到我们这里，但目前还不清楚他们是否会。
Operator 操作员
Our next question will be coming from Chris Allen of Citi.
我们下一个问题将来自花旗集团的克里斯·艾伦。
Chris Allen 克里斯·艾伦
One thing we've been watching is margin balances have been trending up nicely, even in September when the markets were down. And you noted the strength and interest income being driven by financial advisers and hedge funds earlier. On the financial adviser front, are you seeing any benefit from the Schwab-Ameritrade integration that's going on right now? On the hedge fund side, are you— is the existing hedge fund client base expanding in size? Are you winning new hedge fund clients?
我们一直在关注的一件事是，保证金余额一直在稳步上升，即使在九月份市场下跌时也是如此。你之前提到金融顾问和对冲基金推动的利息收入的强劲表现。在金融顾问方面，你们是否看到施瓦布与美林整合带来的任何好处？在对冲基金方面，现有的对冲基金客户群体是否在扩大？你们是否赢得了新的对冲基金客户？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
Well, there are certainly— our salespeople speak a lot about the unhappiness of especially Ameritrade clients that had to go over to Schwab on the one hand. On the other, about Ameritrade clients who were Ameritrade clients in addition to Schwab clients because those clients wanted to have two independent brokerage firms and now that they are only one, they are looking for a second. So these are the two types of clients we are getting from this merger. Now your second question was about the hedge funds, what did you actually ask?
好吧，确实有——我们的销售人员经常谈到特别是那些不得不转到施瓦布的 Ameritrade 客户的不满。另一方面，还有那些既是 Ameritrade 客户又是施瓦布客户的 Ameritrade 客户，因为这些客户希望拥有两家独立的经纪公司，而现在只剩下一家，他们正在寻找第二家。因此，这就是我们从这次合并中获得的两类客户。现在你第二个问题是关于对冲基金的，你实际上问了什么？
Chris Allen 克里斯·艾伦
Yes. Just wanted to know on the hedge fund size, are you seeing new hedge fund wins or the existing customer base...
是的。只是想了解一下对冲基金的规模，你们是看到新的对冲基金获胜，还是现有客户群体...
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
Definitely. Yes. We definitely see new hedge fund wins, yes. They tend—on balance to be smaller funds in the $10 million to $50 million range, and so we get them regularly and quite often.
当然。是的。我们确实看到新的对冲基金获胜，是的。它们通常——总体上来说——是规模较小的基金，范围在 1000 万到 5000 万美元之间，因此我们经常会遇到它们。
Chris Allen 克里斯·艾伦
And just a quick follow-up on the M&A discussion. Are you looking at domestic opportunities, overseas, both? Basically what you do see out there?
关于并购讨论的快速跟进。您是在关注国内机会、海外机会，还是两者都有？基本上您看到的是什么？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
It doesn't matter to us. We’re going either way. We're happy to; we don't care whether it's US or outside.
这对我们来说无所谓。我们无论如何都会去。我们很高兴；我们不在乎是美国还是国外。
Operator 操作员
Our next question will be coming from James Yaro of Goldman Sachs.
我们下一个问题将来自高盛的詹姆斯·亚罗。
James Yaro 詹姆斯·亚罗
It's James Yaro. I think it's quite clear today what the opportunity is in terms of retail trading in Asia. But I think retail trading remains somewhat more subdued in Europe. You are investing in Europe clearly. So maybe you can just speak to your outlook for whether retail trading in Europe will accelerate and potentially over time, look more like what we see in the US and what gives you that sort of confidence?
这是詹姆斯·亚罗。我认为今天关于亚洲零售交易的机会非常明确。但我认为欧洲的零售交易仍然相对低迷。显然，您正在投资欧洲。那么，您能否谈谈您对欧洲零售交易是否会加速的展望，以及随着时间的推移，是否可能更像我们在美国看到的那样，并且是什么让您有这样的信心？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
Generally, I think that, as you know, the United States is basically the hot seat of capitalism and has a history of 200 years, right? In Europe, it has a somewhat longer history, but much more subdued history. So in Europe, traditionally people who invest in the stock market were a very small layer of society. And we expect that, that will expand just like it has expanded in the United States. On the other hand, the average European person has only about 60% to 70% of the funds that the average American person has.
一般来说，我认为，正如你所知道的，美国基本上是资本主义的热土，历史有 200 年，对吧？在欧洲，它的历史稍微长一些，但相对更为低调。因此，在欧洲，传统上投资股市的人群是社会中非常小的一部分。我们预计，这种情况会像在美国那样扩展。另一方面，普通欧洲人的资金大约只有普通美国人的 60%到 70%。
James Yaro 詹姆斯·亚罗
Okay. That's very clear. And then if we were to potentially see Fed funds start to come down, and I'm not saying that's going to happen imminently. But just— maybe you could just speak to...
好的。这很清楚。如果我们可能看到联邦基金利率开始下降，我并不是说这会立即发生。但也许你可以谈谈……
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
Sorry for the laugh. No. I believe that Fed funds will remain in the 5% range indefinitely for the very, very long term. They may come down to 4%, but then they will come up because there is nothing you can do about the ever increasing debt payments. So Fed funds will go to 5%, 6%, 7%, 8%, 10%, 20%, 30%, 40%, 50% until we go into the hole.
抱歉让你笑了。不，我相信联邦基金利率将无限期地保持在 5%的范围内，持续很长时间。它们可能会降到 4%，但随后会再次上升，因为你无法解决不断增加的债务支付问题。因此，联邦基金利率将会上升到 5%、6%、7%、8%、10%、20%、30%、40%、50%，直到我们陷入困境。
James Yaro 詹姆斯·亚罗
Okay. But the market forward curve obviously has cuts. So just— you obviously manage risks very well, Thomas. So I just want to understand how you think about let's say there's downside risk and rates do come down. How do you think about hedging that, if at all? Do you extend securities duration or do you need to do something else?
好的。但是市场远期曲线显然有下调。所以你显然非常擅长风险管理，托马斯。我只是想了解一下，如果说存在下行风险，利率确实下降的话，你是如何考虑对冲的？你是延长证券的久期，还是需要做其他事情？
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
If forward rates go above nearby rates, we may go out forward. But as long as nearby rates are higher, we will not do so.
如果远期利率高于近期利率，我们可能会选择远期交易。但只要近期利率更高，我们就不会这样做。
Operator 操作员
Our next question will be coming from Kyle Voigt of KBW.
我们下一个问题将来自 KBW 的凯尔·沃伊特。
Kyle Voigt 凯尔·沃伊特
Thomas, maybe the first one is for you. Just on your automatic share sale plan. I think that's been paused for most of 2023. Can you just kind of provide an update there on any plans to convert and sell shares? And also just remind us...
托马斯，也许第一个是给你的。关于你的自动股票出售计划。我认为在 2023 年大部分时间里这个计划都暂停了。你能否提供一下关于转换和出售股票的任何计划的更新？还有，请提醒我们...
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
I have a number of—a large number of shares that I have converted. I constantly and always have a sales program on file, and I have a target price, which is 20% under what I believe the fair price for the stock would be. We have not reached that point yet. So when we will, you will see sales from me.
我有很多已经转换的股票。我始终有一个销售计划在档案中，并且我有一个目标价格，低于我认为股票公允价格的 20%。我们还没有达到那个点。所以当我们达到时，你会看到我的销售。
Kyle Voigt 凯尔·沃伊特
Understood. And that's all automatically set in the— this year’s plan.
明白了。这一切都自动设置在今年的计划中。
Thomas Peterffy 托马斯·彼得菲
That’s right. 没错。
Kyle Voigt 凯尔·沃伊特
Understood. The second question is just on the expenses. Last quarter, you spoke about some of the very recent challenges you were seeing in hiring technology talent. Just wondering if you could provide an update there on the market for talent. Are you still seeing the same inflationary pressures that you spoke about last quarter? And how is your hiring plan progressing in 2023 at 5% head count growth versus where you expected it to be when this year started?
明白了。第二个问题是关于费用的。上个季度，您提到了一些在招聘技术人才方面遇到的最新挑战。想知道您能否提供关于人才市场的最新情况。您是否仍然看到上个季度提到的同样的通胀压力？您在 2023 年的招聘计划进展如何，预计员工人数增长 5%与年初时的预期相比如何？
Milan Galik 米兰·加利克
So we do not think about hiring in terms of budgeting the number of people that we have to hire in a particular year. It's much more short term than that. We always know the projects that we are currently working on, the projects that we have, that we would like to work on. We see how many people we need in various groups. There is obviously some amount of attrition that we have to deal with.
所以我们在招聘时并不考虑特定年份需要招聘的人数预算。这远比那更短期。我们总是知道我们目前正在进行的项目，以及我们希望进行的项目。我们会看到各个团队需要多少人。显然，我们必须处理一定程度的人员流失。
And these are the factors that determine when we approve a new position and we go to the market and try to hire them. Recently, we have not had great difficulty finding people at the prices we thought that we would find them. So there is a little bit less competition for the talent compared to last year. But good technologists, the really good technologists are still hard to find and you have to pay up for them.
这些是决定我们何时批准新职位并进入市场尝试招聘的因素。最近，我们在找到符合我们预期价格的人方面没有遇到太大困难。因此，与去年相比，人才的竞争稍微减少了一些。但优秀的技术人才，真正优秀的技术人才仍然难以找到，你必须为他们支付更高的薪酬。
Kyle Voigt 凯尔·沃伊特
Understood. And if I could just sneak one in at the end of the call here for Paul. Other income, I think, on an adjusted basis, was at $20 million. It was the highest in quite some time. Just wondering if you could provide any color on kind of what drove that line and what— if that's a good run rate or we should think about it kind of reverting lower from here?
明白了。如果我可以在通话结束时为保罗插一句话。其他收入，我认为在调整后为 2000 万美元。这是相当长一段时间以来的最高水平。想知道您是否可以提供一些关于推动这一数据的因素，以及这是否是一个良好的运行率，或者我们是否应该考虑它会从这里回落。
Paul Brody 保罗·布罗迪
So it's always difficult to talk about run rate on other income because the primary components are our currency diversification strategy, which obviously fluctuates with the dollar. And we have some other— we have some investments, a few substantial investments that also produced some variability. So in this quarter, it's not that hard to do the math. On our currency diversification, we lost about $17 million, and we made back $20-something million on investments.
所以谈论其他收入的运行率总是很困难，因为主要组成部分是我们的货币多样化策略，这显然会随着美元波动。我们还有一些其他的——我们有一些投资，几项可观的投资也产生了一些变动。因此在这个季度，计算并不难。在我们的货币多样化方面，我们损失了大约 1700 万美元，而在投资方面我们赚回了 2000 多万美元。
So the net of the whole thing was— I mean, together with other normal things, we still have small trading activities and so forth. So we look at other income of $27 million, but mostly that was because we had a non-repeat of last year's $40 million loss on the currency. They produce a lot of noise, which is why we exclude them when we report our non-GAAP numbers.
所以整个事情的净结果是——我意思是，除了其他正常的事情，我们仍然有一些小的交易活动等等。因此，我们看到其他收入为 2700 万美元，但主要是因为我们没有重复去年的 4000 万美元的货币损失。它们产生了很多噪音，这就是为什么我们在报告我们的非 GAAP 数字时将它们排除在外。
Operator 操作员
Thank you. This concludes today's Q&A session. I would like to turn the call back over to Nancy Stuebe for closing remarks. Please go ahead.
谢谢。这次问答环节到此结束。我想把电话交还给南希·斯图比，请她做结束发言。请继续。
Nancy Stuebe 南希·斯图贝
Thank you, everyone, for participating today. As a reminder, this call will be available for replay on our website, and we will also be posting a clean version of our transcript on the site tomorrow. Thank you again, and we will talk to you next quarter end.
谢谢大家今天的参与。提醒一下，这次电话会议将在我们的网站上提供重播，我们明天也会在网站上发布一份干净的文字记录。再次感谢大家，我们下个季度结束时再见。
Operator 操作员
Thank you all for joining today's conference call. You may all disconnect. And everyone, enjoy the rest of your evening.
感谢大家参加今天的电话会议。你们可以断开连接了。祝大家晚上愉快。
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