2024-12-03 Visa Inc. (V) UBS Global Technology and AI Conference (Transcript)

Visa Inc. (NYSE:V) UBS Global Technology and AI Conference December 3, 2024 10:55 AM ET

Company Participants

Chris Suh - Chief Financial Officer

Conference Call Participants

Timothy Chiodo - UBS Securities LLC

Timothy Chiodo

… to be the first one, you do for the third time as well.

Chris Suh

All right, great.

Timothy Chiodo

Let's get into some of the topics here. We've got a great list. So we're going to start with a little bit of an update on recent trends just to tackle that. So coming out of the recent earnings season, five very large, incredible companies that we cover gave an update around October being pretty strong. So Visa, MasterCard, Square, Fiserv, [indiscernible], it was pretty consistent across the board. So now that we're a little bit deeper into the quarter and into the holiday season, maybe you could update us on trends.

让我们开始讨论一些话题。我们有一个很棒的话题列表。首先我们来更新一下近期的趋势。从最近的财报季来看，五家我们所覆盖的非常大且出色的公司给出了关于十月表现不错的更新。所以，包括Visa、MasterCard、Square、Fiserv、[音频不清]，这方面在各家公司之间表现一致。那么现在我们进入了季度的深度阶段，也进入了假期季节，能否更新一下我们关于趋势的信息？

Chris Suh

Yes, happy to. Holiday quarter at Visa, we tend to be data-driven, but given this holiday season, we're staring at even more data than ever before. And so it's fun. Like, shopping days have names, Black Friday, Cyber Monday, the 5 days in between. I guess they call it the Cyber Five. We're just sort of on the other side of that. And I guess today is Giving Tuesday. I just learned that, by the way. So maybe a respite from shopping.

Yes, so let's go back. In October, as you mentioned, a number of companies, including us talked about, we gave our results for Q4, but also talked about the performance that we saw in our underlying drivers in the first 3 weeks. So through October 21, what I said on that day generally was that through the first 3 weeks of October, across most of our underlying business drivers, we had seen a little bit of a tick up from where we finished the previous quarter in Q4. Part of that was due to the lapping of Reg II, but again, it was 3 weeks of data.

Now we're a little more than a month after that, 2 months into the quarter. And at the highest level, I'd say we've continued to see our underlying business drivers remain pretty healthy. And so through two months, U.S payment volumes are sort of consistent with that October update that we gave and a little bit higher than Q4.

Transactions also consistent with that October update and cross border as well has remained healthy, slightly above Q4 levels with eCommerce continued outperform on the relative. So overall drivers are looking pretty healthy. As we sort of click into the holidays, now we have sort of the Thanksgiving weekend, so Thursday through Sunday excluding Cyber Monday as of today since we're just at Tuesday, those 4 days that halt that Thanksgiving weekend, also several points ahead of where we saw a year ago in terms of growth.

And so now the timing's a little bit different. Thanksgiving's a week later this year, and so we'll have to see how all that plays out. But when we sort of put that all together, all to all, sort of quarter-to-date, healthy underlying drivers, driven by what we feel is a pretty resilient underlying consumer demand, the lapping of Reg II, which began a year ago, and what seems to be a solid start to the early part of the holiday shopping season. Obviously, big month left to go in December, so let's see how the month plays out, and we'll have plenty to talk about in our earnings call in January.

是的，很高兴讨论这个问题。Visa的假期季度我们通常是数据驱动的，但考虑到今年的假期季节，我们看到的数据比以往更多。所以很有趣。像购物的日子有名字，黑色星期五、网络星期一、以及中间的五天，我猜它们称为“网络五天”。我们刚刚走过了这个阶段。顺便说一下，今天是“感恩星期二”，我刚知道这件事。也许这算是购物的喘息日吧。

是的，回到正题。正如你提到的，十月期间，包括我们在内的几家公司提到，四季度的业绩很好，还讨论了我们在前 3 周看到的基础业务驱动因素的表现。所以截至 10 月 21 日，我当时说的是，10 月的前 3 周，我们的大多数基础业务驱动因素较上季度有所回升，部分原因是“Reg II”周期的影响，但那时候数据只是三周。

现在，已经过去超过一个月，进入季度的第二个月。从整体来看，我可以说，我们继续看到基础业务驱动因素保持健康。因此，在两个月的时间里，美国的支付量与我们在十月时的更新保持一致，并且略高于第四季度。

交易量也与十月的更新一致，跨境支付也保持健康，略高于第四季度水平，电子商务继续相对表现更好。所以整体业务驱动因素看起来都很健康。随着假期的临近，我们进入了感恩节周末，从星期四到星期天（不包括网络星期一），截至今天，正好是星期二，这四天的表现也比去年增长了几个百分点。

因此，今年感恩节的时间有所不同，晚了一周，所以我们还得看看这一切如何发展。但是总体来说，如果把所有的因素放在一起来看，季度至今的表现相当健康，主要由我们认为相当强劲的消费者需求驱动，还有“Reg II”的影响，从去年开始，另外也有假期购物季初期表现坚实的迹象。当然，12月还有很大一个月的时间，让我们看看12月的走势如何，我们将在一月的财报电话会议上讨论更多内容。

Timothy Chiodo

Right. Thank you, Chris. That's a great way to start things off. Let's go to the next topic, clearly a very topical one, value-added services. So now, roughly mid-20s percentage of your revenue, growing low 20s, big focus from investors. When the company talks about it, you talk about a few different focus areas. So layering additional products and services into Visa transactions. You've also got the non-Visa transactions aspect and then some of the network agnostic solutions. Maybe you could dig into some of that some more, Chris.

好的，谢谢你，Chris。这是一个很好的开场。接下来我们来讨论一下一个非常时下热门的话题——增值服务。现在增值服务大约占你们收入的二十多个百分点，增长率在 20% 左右，这也是投资者的重点关注领域。公司在提到这一点时，通常会讨论几个不同的关注领域。比如在 Visa 交易中加入额外的产品和服务，你们也涉及到非 Visa 交易方面，还有一些跨网络解决方案。Chris，能否更深入地分析一下这些内容？

Chris Suh

Yes, really excited about both the opportunity, the momentum, and the execution of our value-added services business. Tim, as you mentioned, it's growing 20%, a group 20% plus in every single quarter in FY '24, north of 8 billion for the year. It's a big business at scale, growing at 20% plus. And if you take the combination of value-added services and our other growth pillar that we talked about in new flows, which also grew 22% in Q4, combined now more than 30% of our total revenue. So it's great to see our strategy working and paying off across value-added services and new flows.

As you mentioned, there are three -- we think of the addressable opportunity across the three categories that you mentioned. One is services for Visa transactions. Two is services for all transactions, Visa and non. And three are beyond -- services that are beyond payments. And so maybe I'll spend a minute or two on each of those just to sort of dig into that a little bit deeper. So you think about our largest pool of revenue within that, the services for Visa transactions.

This is really, there are a set of services that are really built to ensure that visa remains the best way to pay and be paid. It remains, it invests in the security and the reliability and the health of the overall ecosystem. It includes services like network services, like Visa Account Updater, the dispute tools like Visa Resolve Online, also includes card benefits. This is an important growth area for us. It continues to be an engine that grows both with our transactions, but also grows as clients -- more and more clients use more services, as we add new clients, as we expand into new markets and new geographies, as we launch new products and services. So there continues to be great runway.

And like the rest of our vast [ph] services, it's really powerful in that it -- again, this is all about helping the client grow their business faster and operate in a safer, more secure environment. And so it helps them grow, so it deepens our relationship with them. There's a flywheel effect, but when they grow, it's good for us and it's good for them. And it provides expansive opportunities to diversify our revenue.

The second category is services geared toward all transactions. That includes acceptance services like CyberSource, Authorize.net, and Verifi. It includes DPS, our issuer processor, a U.S.-based debit issuer processor in the U.S. This is a strategically an important area for us. It expands the footprint of our business, expands our addressable opportunity. And in areas like acceptance, it's really also important to be credible.

You have to be sort of agnostic to network because most of our clients accept more than, they're not Visa exclusive in terms of what they accept. And so the ability to be able to support environments outside of our own network is really important. Again, it has many of the same attributes. So it continues to expand our addressable footprint. It helps us really help clients be successful, and that's all goodness for us.

The third category is beyond network payments. This has been the smallest of the sort of the vast pools to date, but it's also really growing really fast. It's a broad category that includes Visa consulting and analytics services, marketing services, now Pismo. And so again, these are growing at a very rapid clip, and we're excited to see that. These services really, again, help our clients be successful and grow their overall volume in business. And when we do that well, it's going to continue to help our vast revenue grow. So all in all, really excited about the momentum, the execution, the scale. We continue to invest in this business, and we have a high degree of confidence that we'll continue to see good results here with our value-added services business.

是的，我对我们的增值服务业务的机会、势头和执行感到非常兴奋。Tim，正如你所提到的，这项业务每个季度都在增长 20%，在 2024 财年每季度都增长超过 20%，全年超过 80 亿。这是一个规模庞大的业务，增长率超过 20%。如果你把增值服务和我们在“新流量”领域的其他增长支柱结合起来，后者在第四季度增长了 22%，现在这两者合起来已超过我们总收入的 30%。所以看到我们的战略在增值服务和新流量方面都取得成果，真是太棒了。

正如你提到的，我们把可利用的机会分为三类。第一类是Visa交易的服务；第二类是所有交易的服务，包括Visa和非Visa交易；第三类是超越支付的服务。所以，我可以简要地介绍一下这三类，并深入分析一下。首先，我们最大的收入池是Visa交易的服务。

这些服务旨在确保Visa仍然是最佳的支付方式。它持续投资于系统的安全性、可靠性和整体健康。它包括网络服务，如Visa账户更新、争议解决工具如Visa Resolve Online，还包括卡片福利。这是我们一个重要的增长领域。它不仅随着交易的增长而增长，而且随着客户使用更多服务、我们新增客户、拓展新市场和新地区、推出新产品和服务，它也在增长。因此，这个领域还有巨大的增长空间。

像我们其他的增值服务一样，这些服务非常强大——它们的核心目的是帮助客户更快速地发展他们的业务，并在更安全的环境中运营。这帮助了客户的成长，同时也加深了我们与客户的关系，形成了良性循环。客户增长对我们来说是有益的，也对他们有益，并为我们提供了多元化收入的机会。

第二类是面向所有交易的服务。包括接受服务如CyberSource、Authorize.net和Verifi，还包括DPS，我们在美国的发卡处理服务商。这对我们来说是一个战略性的重要领域，它扩展了我们的业务足迹，也扩大了我们可利用的机会。在接受服务领域，能够保持中立性非常重要，因为我们的客户大多接受多个网络的支付方式，并不是仅限于Visa。所以，能够在我们自己的网络之外支持其他环境非常重要。这类服务也有类似的特点，继续扩展了我们的可用足迹，帮助我们更好地支持客户的成功，这对我们有很大好处。

第三类是超越支付网络的服务。到目前为止，这一领域是最小的，但它也在快速增长。这是一个广泛的领域，包括Visa的咨询和分析服务、营销服务，还有Pismo。所有这些都在快速增长，我们很高兴看到这一点。这些服务帮助客户成功并促进其整体业务量的增长，当我们做得好时，这将继续推动我们的收入增长。因此，总的来说，我们对增值服务业务的势头、执行力和规模感到非常兴奋，我们将继续在这项业务上进行投资，并且对未来会继续取得良好成果充满信心。

Timothy Chiodo

All right. Great. Thank you, Chris. Let's do one more on value-added services, so a topic that's been coming up more often, which is valuing kind incentives. So maybe just talk about how this has been supportive of value-added services revenue growth. There's maybe also an element there of experimentation from some of your clients. And I would just note that this performance obligation that's in the 10-K, the most recent number was around $4.1 billion, and you referenced that you expect to recognize about half of that over the next 2 years.

好的，非常感谢，Chris。再来讨论一个关于增值服务的话题，近期经常被提及的话题——实物奖励激励。能否谈一下它是如何支持增值服务收入增长的？也许在一些客户的使用中还有实验性因素。我还注意到，在 10-K 文件中提到的履约义务的最新数据大约为 41 亿美元，并且你提到预计在未来两年内会确认其中约一半的金额。

Chris Suh

So the first place I'd start is let's maybe just talk about incentives broadly a little bit. As we've consistently talked about, incentives are a useful tool for us to align our interests and those of our clients on both sides of the network. And when it works well, it really achieves the shared goal, which is to grow volumes, make them more successful, and in turn, that helps grow our business as well. So that's sort of, as you think about incentives broadly.

Now, from time to time, as you mentioned, there's this thing called value-added, we call it VIK, but value in kind. A portion of incentives sometimes are structured in as value in kind, which is effectively a bit of a currency that can be used, again, back to buy additional services or products and services for Visa. We find that clients value this and in many cases prefer it. It allows them to invest exclusively back into things that help grow their card business and grow their card network. And so it's been a powerful and useful tool across our incentive structure broadly.

Now, the mechanics of that, just to get into a little bit of math camp here for a second, is when we include, because you mentioned sort of the RPO number, when you include VIK in a contract, we include that and report that in our 10-Q and 10-K as remaining performance obligation. Now that number that you quoted includes a lot more than just the VIK, but it's included in that number.

And then over the course of the contract term, there's a proportional amount of that VIK is then moved into incentives and reflected on our P&L as a contra revenue line item. And then on our balance sheet as an accrued liability as deferred revenue. And then over time as the clients then use that VIK to purchase additional services, then that transfer -- then we report that as revenue. And if there's costs associated with that, we report that as expense. And so, it's been a really powerful way to engage our clients, to help them grow their business and to create a vehicle by which we're both successful.

首先，我想简单谈谈激励措施。正如我们一直强调的，激励措施是一个有效的工具，帮助我们和客户在网络两端对齐利益。当它运作良好时，它实际上实现了共同的目标——即增加交易量，帮助客户更成功，反过来，这也有助于我们的业务增长。所以，广义上讲，激励措施的目标就是如此。

你提到的“实物奖励”，我们称之为 VIK（物物交换奖励）。在某些情况下，激励的一部分会以 VIK 的形式结构化，这本质上是一种货币形式，可以再次用于购买更多的服务或 Visa 的产品和服务。我们发现客户非常看重这一点，在许多情况下甚至更喜欢它。它允许他们将资金专门用于帮助他们的卡片业务和卡片网络增长。因此，这在我们的激励结构中是一个非常有力且有用的工具。

像是针对商户或者银行的忠诚度计划。

现在谈到这些激励措施的具体操作，简单来说，当我们将 VIK 包括在合同中时，我们会将其报告在 10-Q 和 10-K 文件中作为“剩余履约义务”。你提到的这个数字不仅仅包括 VIK，还有其他内容，但它包含在该数字之内。

在合同期内，VIK 会按照比例转化为激励措施，并作为反向收入项目在我们的利润表中反映，在我们的资产负债表中则作为递延收入的应计负债。当客户使用这些 VIK 购买额外服务时，我们就会把这些转化为收入。如果有相关的成本，我们也会将其作为费用进行报告。因此，这为我们与客户的合作提供了一个非常有效的方式，帮助他们发展业务，同时也创造了一个双方都能成功的途径。

Timothy Chiodo

Excellent. Thank you for running through the mechanics as well. I'm sure everyone appreciates that. Let's hit another topic that is coming up in the investor discussion, so FX volatility. So we talked a little bit about this last year at this conference as well, but it's an impact that can either, well, it can be a positive or a negative to the international revenue line. This was a headwind in fiscal 2024 and expected to be a slight tailwind in fiscal 2025. So with that as a backdrop, maybe you could talk a little bit about the impacts and the mechanics. And then if you don't mind, Chris, when we think about the difference between nominal international revenue growth and nominal cross-border volume growth, it's not just this FX factor, it's a large one, but maybe just touch on the others, meaning corridor mix and pricing.

非常棒，谢谢你详细解释这些操作细节。我相信大家都非常感谢这一点。接下来我们来讨论一个投资者讨论中出现的主题——外汇波动。我们去年在这个会议上也谈到过这个话题，它对国际收入的影响可以是正面的也可以是负面的。2024财年这一点是一个阻力，而预计2025财年会稍微有利一些。那么，基于这一背景，你能谈谈其影响和机制吗？另外，如果你不介意的话，Chris，当我们讨论名义上的国际收入增长和名义上的跨境交易量增长之间的差异时，除了外汇因素，虽然它占比很大，但是否可以谈一谈其他因素，比如走廊组合和定价？

Chris Suh

Yes. Okay. So international transaction revenue, as pointed out. So we report our revenue across four formal lines. We have our service revenues, our data processing revenues, our international transaction revenues, and other revenues. And the international transaction revenue, it's about roughly 25% of our gross revenues before you factor in incentives. So it's a significant contributor to our financial results.

At the highest level, international transaction revenue is really driven by our cross-border business. And that cross-border business you can think of in a couple different ways. One is the volume itself, which we report every quarter. We talk to you about our cross-border volumes, and I just shared with you sort of the update that we're seeing in Q2. But also what impacts it is the yield that we realize against that volume. And one of the big variables in that yield is the volatility of FX.

And so just mechanically, we transact in about 160 currencies globally. We settle in '25. And given the scale and volume on our network, we're able to offer currency conversion services at a very competitive rate. And when we do so, as you mentioned, when there's more volatility or less volatility, as we saw over the last year, that will either widen or narrow the spread. That impacts the amount of revenue that -- and therefore the yield that we see on that cross-border volume.

As you mentioned, in FY '24, it was a bit of a headwind. We saw some low volatility, especially in the middle of the year. What we've guided to in FY '25 anticipates we're able to grow off of that a bit. And so from year to year, it can be a headwind or a tailwind, but we do anticipate that we'll be able to grow off the FY '24 levels. So all in all, that's sort of the big -- one of the big drivers of yield. There are other things that impact yield.

Pricing, certainly there can be different pricing across quarters. The mix of business can impact that because some quarters are priced and have different yields than others. And then the actual FX levels, the impact of hedging, some other things can certainly impact that yield. But all together, that's sort of the international transaction revenue. It's a healthy part of our P&L for sure.

好的。关于国际交易收入，如你所提到的，我们的收入分为四个主要类别：服务收入、数据处理收入、国际交易收入和其他收入。国际交易收入大约占我们总收入的25%，这是一个对我们财务结果贡献非常重要的部分。

从最高层次来看，国际交易收入主要由我们的跨境业务驱动。你可以从几个角度来看待跨境业务。一方面是交易量本身，我们每个季度都会报告跨境交易量，刚才我也与大家分享了第二季度的更新。但影响跨境收入的还有一个因素，就是我们从这些交易量中实现的收益。其中一个重要变量就是外汇波动。

具体来说，我们在全球约有160种货币进行交易。我们在2025年结算。鉴于我们网络的规模和交易量，我们能够以非常具有竞争力的价格提供货币兑换服务。正如你所提到的，当外汇波动较大或较小时，就像我们过去一年所看到的那样，这会使得价差扩大或收窄。这影响了我们跨境交易中所获得的收入和收益。

如你所说，在2024财年，外汇波动对我们构成了一个阻力，尤其是在年中的时候，我们看到波动较低。我们对2025财年的指导预计，我们可以从这种情况中有所增长。因此，年与年之间，外汇波动既可能是阻力也可能是助力，但我们预计我们能从2024财年的水平上有所增长。总的来说，这就是收益的一个主要驱动因素。当然，收益还受其他因素影响。

定价显然也可能在不同季度有所不同。业务组合的差异也会影响收益，因为某些季度的定价和收益率与其他季度不同。此外，实际的外汇水平、对冲的影响以及其他因素也会影响收益率。因此，总体而言，国际交易收入在我们的利润表中占有非常健康的位置。

Timothy Chiodo

Thank you, Chris. A minor follow-up is for the fiscal 2025 guide, I believe that the underlying assumption was that the FX volatility would be at a level that was sort of more representative of the average of the fiscal Q4 rather than sort of as of the date of earnings, it was more the average of fiscal Q4.

谢谢，Chris。关于2025财年的指引，我有个小问题，我相信你们的假设是外汇波动将会处于一个类似于第四财季平均水平的状态，而不是财报日期时的水平，实际上是基于第四财季的平均水平。

Chris Suh

That's right. That's a good clarification. And I'll also just remind people that when you look at the publicly traded, so the CVIK [ph], it's not going to be identical to our volatility, our realized volatility, because the basket of currencies can differ a bit. And so while those might be, there's some correlation, it's not a one-to-one relationship, certainly.

没错，这个问题澄清得很好。我还要提醒大家，当你们看公开交易的数据时，比如说 CVIK [音频不清]，它的波动性并不会完全与我们的实际波动性一致，因为货币篮子的构成可能会有所不同。所以虽然两者之间有一定的相关性，但它们并不是一对一的关系。

Timothy Chiodo

Thank you, Chris. I'm glad you made that mention, because investors do ask about that often. All right, let's move on to the next topic, which is operating expenses, and we'll touch on tax rate as well. So on operating expenses for fiscal 2025, you talked about an expectation for growth in the high single-digit to low double-digit range. You talked about some investment behind new flows, value-added services, and then some of the sales efforts that you're building out in some specific countries, specific initiatives, et cetera. So maybe let's hit OpEx, and then we'll circle back on tax rates.

谢谢你，Chris。我很高兴你提到了这一点，因为投资者确实经常询问这个问题。好了，接下来我们来讨论下一个话题——运营费用，我们也会谈到税率问题。关于2025财年的运营费用，你提到预计增长会处于高个位数到低双位数的区间。你谈到了在新流量、增值服务方面的一些投资，还有你们在一些特定国家、特定计划中的销售努力等。我们可以先讨论一下运营费用，然后再回到税率的问题。

Chris Suh

Okay. Really at the highest level, at the end of the day, we're -- as a company, we focus on two things, right? We focus on providing a great service to our clients, helping them grow and in turn -- providing us a great, secure reliable network and that drive long-term stable, consistent revenue growth for us. So we're focused on top line growth by being a great partner to our clients.

And secondly, we focus on operating our company in the most disciplined and thoughtful way possible in terms of how we deploy resources against that goal to grow top line. I think over the course of time we've done that pretty well, which really is reflected in the strong revenue growth that we've turned in over time, and also the business profile that exists today, which is a very profitable business, high margin profile, all that.

And so I think, as you think about sort of those two levers broadly, as you mentioned, for this year we've guided to high single digits to low double digits. Because while we're trying to achieve those two objectives, it's always a balancing act, right? It's a balancing act of investing in short, medium and long-term priorities. And today, as we look at the addressable opportunity that we've talked about quite a bit across consumer payments, across new flows, across value-added services, in many senses, there's more opportunity, big addressable markets, and more opportunity than we've ever seen before. And so it's a very rigorous process, a very thoughtful process that we have to go through in order to balance those priorities.

You asked a question like, what are we investing in? And I would sort of almost add on to your question and say, it's important to understand what we're investing in, but also as an investor, I think it's important to understand like how we go about making some of those prioritization decisions and trade-offs. From what we're investing in, we're investing in, as you mentioned, new flows and value-added services. I talked about the strong growth that we're seeing, 30% of our business growing, 20%. It's fantastic. We're going to continue to invest in that growth pillar, in both of those growth pillars.

We're investing in innovation, Visa Flex Credentials is an example of something that we're excited about. Visa A2A, another one. We're investing in acquisitions, so we closed Pismo close to a year ago. We're anticipating closing Featurespace in the upcoming month. We have Prosa on the horizon as well, so we're investing in acquisitions. We're investing in specialized sales force side of the business as we think about, again, value-added services and new flows and the requirements, a different go-to-market model than maybe our traditional consumer payments business. So we're investing in all these things.

The second part of the question is, like, how do we go invest in these things? I think really important. My commitment to you as shareholders in Visa is that we're going to continue to be as rigorous and as disciplined as we can in the how we go invest in that. That means understanding deeply like what are the really addressable opportunities that Visa's in the best position to go capture, understanding and sort of memorializing what success looks like, what are the criteria, what are the KPIs that I'm going to hold the business accountable in order to go invest in these, and ensure that we have great ROI, that we have the accountability with our senior leaders who commit to go deliver on some big initiative and that we're going to operate the company with that sort of rigor and discipline.

And the last one is ensuring that we really look at every dollar that we spend and make sure that before we go grow our investment, we're going to be smart about reprioritizing away from things that maybe no longer are the most strategically important or aren't paying off in the ways that we anticipated. And so we are seeing us do all that. You don't get exposed to that as much, but that's sort of the inside baseball in terms of how we operate the company, that we really focus on that rigor.

And then we have to make some very good judgment calls in terms of how we balance across those short and medium and long-term priorities. But I think it's really, really important that we continue to invest in our long-term growth and that's going to continue to be a priority.

好的。从最高层次来看，最终作为公司，我们专注于两件事。首先，我们专注于为客户提供优质服务，帮助他们成长，并从而为我们提供一个安全可靠的网络，这将推动我们长期稳定、持续的收入增长。所以，我们通过成为客户的优秀合作伙伴来专注于营收增长。

其次，我们专注于以最具纪律性和深思熟虑的方式运营公司，确保我们将资源投入到推动营收增长的目标中。我认为，随着时间的推移，我们在这方面做得相当好，这也体现在我们持续的强劲收入增长上，以及今天公司的业务结构，它是一个非常盈利的企业，具有较高的利润率。

因此，当你想到这两个杠杆时，正如你所提到的，对于今年，我们预计增长会在高个位数到低双位数之间。因为尽管我们在努力实现这两个目标，但这始终是一个平衡的过程。我们需要平衡短期、中期和长期的优先事项。今天，当我们审视我们在消费者支付、新流量和增值服务等领域的可寻求机会时，在很多方面，我们看到的机会比我们以往见过的还要多。市场规模更大，机会更多。所以我们需要经过非常严格且深思熟虑的过程，才能平衡这些优先事项。

你问到我们在投资什么？我几乎可以进一步补充说，了解我们在投资什么很重要，但作为投资者，我认为也很重要的是了解我们如何做出这些优先级决策和权衡。从我们投资的方向来看，正如你所提到的，我们在投资新流量和增值服务。我已经谈到过我们在这方面的强劲增长，30%的业务增长了20%。这非常好，我们将继续在这两个增长领域进行投资。

我们也在投资创新，Visa Flex Credentials 就是我们非常兴奋的一个例子。Visa A2A 也是其中之一。我们还在投资并购，去年差不多完成了 Pismo 的收购，我们预计在未来一个月完成对 Featurespace 的收购，Prosa 也在我们的计划中，所以我们也在投资并购。同时，我们也在投资专业化的销售团队，因为我们考虑到增值服务和新流量的需求，这需要与我们传统的消费者支付业务不同的市场模式。所以我们在这些方面都在进行投资。

问题的第二部分是，我们如何进行这些投资？我认为这是非常重要的。我对 Visa 的股东的承诺是，我们将继续以尽可能严格和深思熟虑的方式进行投资。这意味着深入了解 Visa 在最佳位置上能够捕捉到的真正可行机会，理解并明确什么是成功，成功的标准是什么，哪些关键绩效指标 (KPI) 将被用来考核我们的业务，以确保我们获得良好的投资回报，并且确保我们与承诺交付大规模计划的高层领导保持责任感，我们将以这种严格和纪律性来运营公司。

最后，我们要确保仔细审视每一美元的开支，在我们增加投资之前，要确保通过优先调整不再是最具战略意义的领域，或未能按预期带来回报的项目。我们正在做到这一点，虽然你们可能不太接触到这些，但这就是我们如何运营公司的内部做法，我们真正关注这种严格性。

同时，我们还需要做出非常明智的判断，以平衡短期、中期和长期的优先事项。但我认为，继续投资于我们的长期增长非常重要，这将始终是我们的优先事项。

Timothy Chiodo

Excellent. Thank you, Chris. A brief one just on tax rate, but Visa did confirm that any potential impact associated with Singapore's potential adoption of Pillar Two has already been in the guides. Your tax rate guidance was 18% to 18.5% for the year. And again, it implies there was some degree of mitigating action taking place. And maybe you could just make a quick comment on the Pillar Two topic.

非常棒，谢谢，Chris。我有一个简短的问题关于税率，但Visa已经确认与新加坡可能采纳的第二支柱（Pillar Two）相关的潜在影响已经纳入了指引。你们对税率的指引为18%至18.5%。再次强调，这意味着已经采取了一些缓解措施。或许你可以对第二支柱这一话题做简短的评论。

Chris Suh

Right. Just to reiterate, the 18.5% was the expected ETR for FY '25. That is a little bit higher than FY '24, but that's mainly, as we talked about on the call, mainly due to the fact that we have some benefits, some one-time benefits to the tax rate in FY '24. As you should expect, when we give guidance for the year, it contemplates all known factors and information. And so the impact of Pillar Two, our tax team does a very good job of managing our overall tax burden, and it's all contemplated within the guide that we gave for the fiscal year.

没错，我再强调一下，18.5% 是我们对2025财年的预计有效税率（ETR）。这个数字稍微高于2024财年，但主要原因正如我们在电话会议上所谈到的，2024财年我们有一些税率方面的收益，属于一次性收益。你应该预期，当我们给出全年指引时，已经考虑了所有已知的因素和信息。因此，第二支柱的影响，我们的税务团队非常擅长管理我们的整体税负，这一切都已包含在我们给出的财年指引中。

Timothy Chiodo

Excellent. Thank you, Chris. I'm sure investors appreciate that. Let's move on to Visa Flexible Credentials. So you mentioned on the last earnings call, there was a stat you gave that there's already more than 100 issuers that are looking to use this offering. So let's just talk maybe about what that means for those issuers and for Visa.

非常棒，谢谢你，Chris。我相信投资者会感激这一点。接下来我们来谈谈Visa Flexible Credentials。在上次的财报电话会议上，你提到有一个数据，已经有超过100个发行商正在考虑使用这一产品。我们可以讨论一下这对这些发行商和Visa意味着什么吗？

Chris Suh

Yes, we're super excited about this one. And as you can see, there's a lot of issuers that are enthused as well. A couple of recent news items we launched. We're live now in the U.S with the firm. We'll talk about that here in a second. And we've also recently announced a partnership collaboration with Liv, the first and largest digital bank in UAE, to bring a whole new use case to Visa Flexible Credentials. But before -- so we'll get into all that, but before we get into that, maybe just backing up a little bit, like what is it and how did we get here.

So Visa Flexible Credentials is -- we like to call it the Swiss Army knife of payments because it really is a single card that enables consumers to toggle between multiple funding sources, so credit, debit, prepaid, commercial, and even rewards points. And so it gives users, consumers, great control, gives banks ways to engage deeply with their clients. It's a very sticky relationship as well. We launched a little over a year ago in Japan with SMCC under the brand Olive. And in the year plus since we've launched, it's been very successful. We have over 3 million Olive accounts created that are taking advantage of Flex. And of those 3 million, 70% are actually toggling between different funding sources, which I think is an interesting stat for us.

And by the way, credit tends to be the one that they're using the most for purchasing as well. That's what our data suggests. We're continuing to partner really well with SMCC. We're now experimenting with a small business offering that's going to allow SMCC customers to toggle between personal and business accounts. And so think about sort of the great unlock there is for small business owners who are managing their cash flow. So we'll continue to experiment with that with SMCC in Japan, and when ready, we'll roll that out around the world.

Building on that success, we're now live with Affirm in the U.S., giving access to Affirm's roughly 1.4 million cardholders, the ability to toggle between credit, debit, and buy now, pay later. I think that's going to be sort of an interesting. Since its early days, obviously, and we'll see how that goes. We're excited about that. The other one we're excited about that I mentioned briefly is Liv, the big digital bank in UAE. They're creating a whole new use case around Flex, it's the ability to toggle between accounts in multiple currencies. And so think about the unlock for people that travel a lot, and UAE happens to be an area where outbound cross-border travel is one of our faster growing parts of the business in a market that is a large cross-border market.

And so, this flexibility gives users more control, more transparency, more visibility in how they spend. As you know, traveling cross-border sometimes is, there's some complexities to that. You don't really -- sometimes consumers don't understand the currency mechanisms. And so the ability to toggle between multiple currency, we think, is an interesting use case, and we'll see how that plays out over time as well. So all in all, you think about -- why we're excited about Flex, it really is all about giving users, consumers, more control, more transparency, more visibility. It's allowing our clients, whether they're financial institutions or FinTechs, more control and therefore stickier relationships with their clients. And we're excited about the opportunities in front of us.

是的，我们对这个项目非常兴奋，正如你所看到的，很多发行商也充满热情。最近我们推出了一些新的消息。我们现在在美国与Affirm一起推出了这个功能，我们稍后会谈到这个。此外，我们还宣布了与阿联酋最大数字银行Liv的合作，推出全新的Visa Flexible Credentials应用场景。但是在详细介绍之前，先简单回顾一下它是什么，以及我们是如何走到这一步的。

Visa Flexible Credentials就像我们所说的“支付界的瑞士军刀”，因为它实际上是一张可以让消费者在多个资金来源之间切换的卡片，包括信用卡、借记卡、预付卡、商业卡甚至是奖励积分。这为用户提供了很大的控制权，也为银行提供了深度与客户互动的机会，且这种关系非常粘性。我们大约在一年前与SMCC在日本推出了品牌Olive。自推出以来，它非常成功，目前已经创建了超过300万个Olive账户，这些账户正在使用Visa Flexible Credentials，其中70%的账户实际上在不同的资金来源之间切换，我认为这个统计数据很有趣。

顺便说一下，消费者在购买时最常使用的是信用卡。这是我们的数据所表明的。我们继续与SMCC保持良好的合作。现在，我们正在尝试为小企业提供一项服务，允许SMCC的客户在个人账户和商业账户之间切换。这对于小企业主在管理现金流时非常有帮助。所以我们将在日本与SMCC继续试验这一点，准备好后，我们将在全球范围内推广。

在这个成功的基础上，我们现在在美国与Affirm合作，约140万持卡人可以在信用卡、借记卡和“先买后付”之间进行切换。我认为这是一个很有趣的尝试。自从它的初期阶段开始，我们已经看到了它的一些潜力。我们对此感到非常兴奋。另外，我简短提到的一个项目是阿联酋的Liv银行。他们正在创建一个全新的Visa Flexible Credentials的应用场景，就是能够在多个货币账户之间切换。对于经常出差的人来说，这非常有用，而阿联酋恰好是跨境旅行增长最快的市场之一，也是我们业务中的一个大市场。

因此，这种灵活性给用户提供了更多的控制、更高的透明度和可见性。正如你所知道的，跨境旅行有时会带来一些复杂性，消费者有时不太了解货币机制。所以能够在多个货币之间切换，我们认为这是一个有趣的应用场景，我们将看到它如何随时间发展。总的来说，我们之所以对Visa Flexible Credentials如此兴奋，是因为它真正地为用户、消费者提供了更多的控制、更高的透明度和可见性。这也让我们的客户，无论是金融机构还是金融科技公司，拥有更多的控制力，因此与客户的关系也变得更加紧密。我们对眼前的机会充满信心。

Timothy Chiodo

Excellent. Let's hit on something you mentioned, which is Pismo. So you closed that acquisition in January of 2024, and there's already been some disclosure about some of the large bank clients, Citi being one of them. Maybe you could just talk a little bit about the business there and some of the traction you're seeing now that we're roughly at the 1-year anniversary.

非常好。接下来我们可以谈谈你提到的Pismo。你们在2024年1月完成了这项收购，已经有关于一些大银行客户的信息披露，花旗银行就是其中之一。能否谈一谈这项业务以及我们进入大约1周年时看到的一些进展？

Chris Suh

Correct. We closed Pismo just almost a year ago, and it's been a terrific year, bringing them into Visa, being part of Visa, made great progress. We're seeing enthusiasm from our clients, as you mentioned. What is Pismo? Why -- how does it fit into the Visa portfolio? Pismo is, like with many things that we do, especially on the acquisition side, it starts with a very client-centric approach. Clients have been sharing with Visa their cloud transformation journey, their modernization of their tech banking stack, and some of the needs that they had as they wanted to expand faster and they wanted a more agile and nimble platform that had more capabilities.

没错，我们几乎一年前就完成了对Pismo的收购，这一年的进展非常棒，把Pismo引入Visa，成为Visa的一部分，我们取得了巨大的进展。正如你提到的，我们看到了来自客户的热情。那么，Pismo是什么？它如何融入Visa的业务组合？像我们做的许多事情一样，尤其是收购方面，我们的出发点是非常以客户为中心的。客户与Visa分享了他们在云端转型过程中遇到的挑战，以及他们在现代化技术银行架构中的一些需求，他们希望更快地扩展业务，需要一个更灵活、更敏捷的平台，且具有更多功能。

So we sort of listened, we heard that, we understood the opportunity, we looked around the world, we talked to -- we looked at hundreds of companies literally, talked to dozens of them and the one we landed on was Pismo. It stood out among the rest. Great tech, great people, great leaders. Pismo is a modern core banking issuer processor with cloud native APIs. It is global in nature. So we have an issuer processor in the U.S called DPS. It's primarily U.S., primarily debit, and with Pismo you get global presence and you get products, a broader product set outside of debit, credit, debit, commercial and so there's just sort of more flexibility there.

所以我们倾听了客户的需求，理解了这个机会，我们环顾全球，实际与数百家公司进行了对话，并与其中几十家公司进行了深入交流，最后我们选择了Pismo。它在众多公司中脱颖而出，拥有优秀的技术、优秀的人才和优秀的领导者。Pismo是一个现代化的核心银行发行处理平台，具有云原生API，具有全球化特点。因此，我们在美国有一个发行处理平台叫做DPS，它主要针对美国市场，主要处理借记卡。而Pismo则提供全球覆盖，提供的产品类别也更广泛，不仅仅是借记卡，信用卡，借记卡，商业卡等，因此在灵活性方面有了更多选择。

And so these things come together, they're complementary to each other from a go-to-market standpoint. In the U.S. we'll continue to offer DPS, but for clients who are looking for a cloud native platform, we have Pismo, and looking to expand in credit and other things outside of debit. Pismo is also available outside the U.S. We have great presence already in a number of markets. We'll continue to grow there, LAC, Europe, and AP and we'll continue to invest in that. It is a little longer sales cycle. You mentioned the great momentum we have with clients. Citi is one of them. They're looking for a platform or partner to help them become more agile in bringing innovations and updates and features to their clients. I think Pismo does that. We also renewed our deal with Itaú in Brazil. Great momentum, the pipeline looks good. There's already nearly 12 billion API calls a month on Pismo, we're excited to continue to expand this and bring it to our clients globally in FY '25.

这些因素相结合，从市场推广的角度来看，它们是互补的。在美国，我们将继续提供DPS，但对于那些寻求云原生平台的客户，我们有Pismo，且Pismo还可以扩展到信用卡及其他非借记卡产品领域。Pismo也在美国之外提供服务。我们已经在多个市场中占据了重要地位，并将继续在拉丁美洲、欧洲和亚太地区拓展市场。虽然Pismo的销售周期稍长，但我们已经取得了巨大的进展。你提到我们与客户之间的强劲势头，花旗银行就是其中之一。花旗银行正在寻找一个平台或合作伙伴，帮助他们在为客户带来创新、更新和新功能方面变得更加灵活。我认为Pismo可以做到这一点。此外，我们还与巴西的Itaú银行续签了协议，势头非常好，销售管道也很不错。目前，Pismo每月已经处理近120亿次API调用，我们对继续扩展并在2025财年将其带给全球客户感到非常兴奋。

Timothy Chiodo

All right, great. Well, with the time we have left, why don't we just touch on 1033, so the recent draft from the CFPB around account access rules and standards. Maybe talk around Visa's potential role here, whether it be Tink or other aspects of the company.

好的，感谢。既然时间有限，我们就简单谈谈1033——最近CFPB关于账户访问规则和标准的草案。能否谈谈Visa在这里的潜在角色，是否包括Tink或公司其他方面的参与？

Chris Suh

Okay. I'll try to give the 1.5 minute version of it. Our preliminary read of the final rules from the CFPB seems to be largely consistent with their preliminary rulings. We've long been advocates for giving consumers more control and more flexibility and more access to their data. And at the highest level, we will certainly -- our capabilities will certainly comply with the CFPB's rulings, which in many ways is consistent with what our clients expect from us in terms of privacy and security.

好的，我会尽量简短地说明。我们初步解读CFPB的最终规则似乎与他们的初步裁决大致一致。我们一直是支持给予消费者更多控制、更大灵活性和更多访问自己数据的权利。总体而言，我们的能力将完全符合CFPB的裁决，这在许多方面也与我们的客户在隐私和安全方面对我们的期望是一致的。

With regard to Tink, Tink is a European open banking platform that we acquired in 2022. They've had good success in Europe, bringing an open banking platform to many markets. And we continue to invest in that. We're now live in the U.S and we'll continue to invest in that. And at the end of the day, anything that we've been long supportive of, sort of the open banking platform and anything that continues to increase the presence of open banking in the U.S. like it is in Europe, Tink is in across 18 countries in Europe today, I think is a good thing. And bringing it all together, I think Visa's brand, the trust, the reliability, I think can be an unlock for the future, for open banking, and together with Tink, we'll continue to invest and grow in that business.

关于Tink，Tink是我们在2022年收购的欧洲开放银行平台。Tink在欧洲取得了良好的成功，将开放银行平台引入多个市场。我们继续在这一业务上进行投资。目前我们已经在美国上线，并将继续投资这个平台。最终来说，我们一直支持开放银行平台，并且支持任何能推动美国开放银行发展，类似于欧洲市场的做法。Tink目前已经在欧洲18个国家运营，我认为这是件好事。把这一切结合起来，我认为Visa的品牌、信任和可靠性，可以为未来的开放银行提供一种解锁机会，和Tink一起，我们将继续在这一业务上进行投资和增长。

Timothy Chiodo

Great. Well, Chris, Jennifer, on behalf of everyone at UBS, we just want to thank you for taking the time to be with us here in Arizona. It's a pleasure hosting you.

太棒了。Chris，Jennifer，代表UBS的所有人，感谢你们抽时间来到这里与我们一起参加会议。很高兴能接待你们。

Chris Suh

Great.

非常感谢。

Timothy Chiodo

We hope you have a great conference.

希望你们在会议期间一切顺利。

Chris Suh

Thanks, Tim. Thanks, everyone.

谢谢Tim，谢谢大家。

Question-and-Answer Session

Q -

[No formal Q&A for this event.]

2024-12-03 Visa Inc. (V) UBS Global Technology and AI Conference (Transcript)

2024-12-03 Visa Inc. (V) UBS Global Technology and AI Conference (Transcript)

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