The contents of this transcript are for educational and entertainment purposes only, and do not purport to be, and are not intended to be financial, legal, accounting, tax, or investment advice. Investments or strategies that are discussed may not be suitable for you, do not take into account your particular investment objectives, financial situation, or needs, and are not intended to provide investment advice or recommendations appropriate for you. Before making any investment or trade, consider whether it is suitable for you and consider seeking advice from your own financial or investment adviser.

本记录稿的内容仅用于教育和娱乐目的，并非也无意成为财务、法律、会计、税务或投资建议。所讨论的投资或策略可能不适合您，没有考虑到您的特定投资目标、财务状况或需求，也无意提供适合您的投资意见或建议。在进行任何投资或交易之前，请考虑该投资或交易是否适合您，并考虑向您自己的财务或投资顾问寻求建议。

Robert: Thank you so much for joining us today at "Exploring the Legacy of Charlie Munger, a Conversation With Mohnish Pabrai." Hello. My name is Robert Pittenger with the YPO Mosaic Chapter. Mohnish Pabrai has been a YPO member since 1997, lives in Austin, Texas, and graduated from Clemson University. He is the CEO of Dhandho Funds, which he grew from a million dollars with eight investors to  million as of December 31st. A massive growth in that time. Mohnish authored two books on value investing, The Dhandho Investor and Mosaic: Perspectives on Investing. So it is only fitting that he is speaking to the YPO Mosaic Chapter today. Mohnish is a highly successful value investor who did it, according to him, by "shamelessly cloning" the management decisions of Warren Buffett and Charlie Munger. He always says thank you to them for his success. Mohnish Pabrai along with fellow YPO Guy Spier teamed up to purchase the 2007 charity lunch with Warren and Charlie for $650,000. The lunch was life-changing for both gentlemen and Mohnish is here to tell us more about his close friend, Charlie Munger, which he developed out of that lunch. Besides his friendship with Charlie, one of the things Mohnish is proudest of is his lifetime ban from a casino in Las Vegas for his Blackjack crowds. Mohnish thank you for being with us today. We are so grateful, and we look forward to hearing some of your wisdom about Charlie and about playing Blackjack. The first thing that we would like to start with is there is a quote that you have talked about that Charlie Munger has said, which is, "Take a simple idea and take it seriously." Can you talk to us about what that means? What did Charlie mean by that line and how did you apply it in your life and your investing?

罗伯特：非常感谢您参加今天的 "探索查理-芒格的遗产，与莫尼什-帕布雷的对话"。大家好。我是YPO马赛克分会的罗伯特-皮坦格（Robert Pittenger）。Mohnish Pabrai自1997年以来一直是YPO会员，住在德克萨斯州奥斯汀，毕业于克莱姆森大学。他是 Dhandho Funds 基金公司的首席执行官，该公司从最初只有八名投资者的一百万美元发展到截至 12 月 31 日的8.4亿美元。在此期间实现了巨大的增长。Mohnish 著有两本关于价值投资的书：《The Dhandho Investor》和《Mosaic: Perspectives on Investing》。因此，他今天在YPO Mosaic分会发表演讲是再合适不过了。Mohnish 是一位非常成功的价值投资者，据他自己说，他是通过 "无耻地克隆 "沃伦-巴菲特和查理-芒格的管理决策而取得成功的。他总是对他们的成功表示感谢。Mohnish Pabrai 与同为 YPO 的 Guy Spier 合作，以 65 万美元的价格购买了 2007 年与沃伦和查理的慈善午餐。这次午餐改变了两位先生的人生，Mohnish 将在这里向我们详细介绍他的密友查理-芒格（Charlie Munger）。除了与查理的友谊之外，莫尼什最引以为豪的一件事是，他因为玩二十一点而被拉斯维加斯的一家赌场终身禁入。莫尼希感谢您今天的光临。我们非常感谢，我们期待着聆听您关于查理和玩 21 点的一些智慧结晶。首先，我们想从您谈到的查理-芒格说过的一句话开始，那就是 "接受一个简单的想法并认真对待它"。你能跟我们谈谈这句话的含义吗？查理的这句话是什么意思，你是如何将它运用到你的生活和投资中的？

还有另一个很好的表述：Less but Better，可以遵循更简单的方法但必须也是更好的方法。

Mohnish: First of all, it is a pleasure to be with you. It is always a pleasure to talk to YPOs. Like many of you, YPO has completely changed my life for the better. I cannot even imagine what my life would have been if there was no YPO. There were just so many changes and improvements YPO brought along. I also wanted to share my grief and condolences with all of you on October 7th. Many of you, directly or indirectly, maybe knew some of the victims or the people who got injured or who got taken hostage. My thoughts and prayers are with you on that, and hopefully, we will get to a finish line on that at some reasonable point. My friendship with Charlie was quite unexpected and accidental. I never expected to even meet him. That was a great bonus of my life.

莫尼什：首先，很高兴与您在一起。与YPO交流总是一件令人愉快的事。和你们中的许多人一样，YPO彻底改变了我的生活。我甚至无法想象，如果没有YPO，我的生活会是什么样子。YPO给我带来了太多的改变和进步。10月7日，我还想与大家分享我的悲痛和哀悼。你们中的许多人可能直接或间接地认识一些受害者、受伤者或被劫持的人质。对此，我与你们同在，并为你们祈祷，希望我们能在某个合理的时间点找到答案。我和查理的友谊是意外和偶然的。我从没想过能遇到他。这是我人生中的一大收获。

The first time I met Charlie was even before the Buffett lunch. It was at a YPO event. One of the YPOers, Peter Kaufman, arranged for him to speak to YPO. I had just moved to California. That was around 2004. That was the first time I met Charlie and hung out with him a bit. The quote you brought up "Take a simple idea and take it seriously," is a famous Munger quote and it is something that I have always tried to practice in my life even before I

我第一次见到查理是在巴菲特午餐之前。那是在 YPO 的一次活动上。YPO的一位成员彼得-考夫曼（Peter Kaufman）安排他到YPO演讲。当时我刚搬到加利福尼亚。那是 2004 年左右。那是我第一次见到查理，并和他一起玩了一会儿。你提到的那句 "接受一个简单的想法并认真对待它 "是芒格的名言，也是我在生活中一直努力践行的，甚至在我还没有

heard of Charlie, or even before I heard about that quote because it is so powerful. As we go through life, we get some aha moments, where we uncover some nugget of wisdom or knowledge that maybe many other humans have either not figured out or not given the amount of weight they should to that particular piece of wisdom and knowledge. It can become a source of a tremendous competitive advantage. One of the things I learned about very early was the power of cloning and the power of copying.

我听说过查理，甚至在我听说这句话之前，因为它太有力量了。在我们的生活中，我们会有一些 "啊哈 "时刻，我们会发现一些智慧或知识，而这些智慧或知识可能是其他许多人都没有弄明白的，或者是他们没有给予这些智慧和知识应有的重视。它可以成为巨大竞争优势的源泉。我很早就了解到克隆的力量和复制的力量。

Apperceptive masses：《I.H.6.Warren Buffett.The “aha” moment for Buffett that changed everything》，我们都受噪音的影响。

I remember when I was in my early twenties, I read a book by Tom Peters. He was a big management guru in the eighties. In that book, he was giving the example of two gas stations in California that were diagonal on a busy intersection from each other. Both the gas stations were self-service stations. You come in, you pump your gas, and you leave. The owner would come out maybe once an hour, pick a random car, wash the windshield, or check the oil; just some extra service at no charge. The guy who was diagonal across the street was seeing this take place. He said to himself, "Well, that is kind of stupid. You cannot do it for everyone. If you did it for everyone, you would lose your shirt because you are not charging for it. He never copied or cloned that.

我记得在我二十出头的时候，我读过汤姆-彼得斯（Tom Peters）写的一本书。他是八十年代的管理大师。在那本书里，他举了一个例子：加利福尼亚州有两个加油站，分别位于一个繁忙十字路口的对角线上。这两个加油站都是自助加油站。你进来，加油，然后离开。店主可能一小时出来一次，随便挑一辆车，洗一下挡风玻璃，或者检查一下机油；只是一些额外的服务，不收取任何费用。斜对面的那个人看到了这一幕。他对自己说："嗯，这有点愚蠢。你不能为每个人都这样做。如果你为每个人都这样做，否则你会赔得血本无归，因为你没有收费。他从来没有复制或克隆过。

Over time, what happened is that the gas station that was providing this random extra service saw an increase in business, and the one diagonal from him saw a decrease. Even after seeing the decrease, the guy across the street did not change his behavior. Tom Peter said, and this is what I found very unbelievable, that you can go to your most direct competitors and you can sit down with them, and you can give them all your trade scenes, everything that you learned that has given you an advantage, and they will listen to you, but there will be no behavior change. When I read that, I said, "This is ridiculous. This cannot be the way the world works." I am in my early twenties, I haven't kind of experienced life, and I don't know kind of how things work, but I made a promise to myself that I was going to prove Tom Peters wrong, and I was going to prove him wrong two ways. One, I was going to look for instances where humans see something smart happening and copy or clone it, because that would prove him wrong, and the second is, whenever I see someone doing something smart, I am going to copy it because that also proves him wrong. From my early twenties till now, this year, I am going to be 60, what I found, because I became a student of this, is that Tom Peters was mostly right. I still do not know why this is the case, but humans have an aversion to cloning. They somehow consider it beneath themselves that they did not come up with the idea. What I also found is that when I forced myself to copy things that I found to be smart, it gave me a big edge. This was an example of a simple idea. What I found is that there was a very small sliver of humans who were master cloners, and these humans owned the world. They did very well.

随着时间的推移，提供这种随机额外服务的加油站的生意越来越好，而他斜对面的加油站的生意却越来越差。即使看到生意减少，街对面的那个人也没有改变他的行为。汤姆-彼得说，这是我觉得非常不可思议的地方，你可以去找你最直接的竞争对手，你可以和他们坐下来，把你所有的商业秘密说给他们，你所学到的一切能给你带来优势的东西，他们会听你的，但行为不会改变。当我读到这句话时，我说："这太荒谬了。世界不可能是这样运转的"。我才二十出头，还没有经历过生活，也不知道事情是怎么运作的，但我向自己承诺，我要证明汤姆-彼得斯是错的，我要从两个方面证明他是错的。第一，我要寻找人类看到聪明的事情发生的实例，并复制或克隆它，因为这将证明他是错的；第二，每当我看到有人做聪明的事情时，我就要复制它，因为这也证明他是错的。从我二十出头到现在，今年我就要六十岁了，我发现，因为我成为了这方面的学生，汤姆-彼得斯大部分时候都是对的。我仍然不知道为什么会这样，但人类对克隆有一种反感。他们莫名其妙地认为，不是自己想出了这个主意，就有失身份。我还发现，当我强迫自己复制那些我认为聪明的东西时，会给我带来很大的优势。这是一个简单想法的例子。我发现，有极少数人类是克隆高手，这些人类拥有整个世界。他们做得非常好。

其实是对好和坏的感觉，如果5分钟以内不能彻底明白，一辈子都不可能明白，大量负面的Apperceptive masses是长期形成的。

For example, almost everything at Microsoft is cloned. Microsoft spends billions of dollars on its research labs. Nothing has ever come out of that. What has worked for them is looking at Lotus and creating Excel, looking at WordPerfect and creating Word, looking at the Mac and creating Windows, and so on. Even now, OpenAl is a partnership with AI. Google did the work. Microsoft did none of the work, and they are ahead. Sam Walton was another great cloner. In fact, James Sinegal, former CEO of Costco, had cloned the entire model from Sol Price, who he used to work for. Someone asked him, "What did you learn from Sol Price?" His response was, "It is the wrong question. Everything I know is from Sol Price. There is nothing I know that did not come from Sol Price." These were people who took a simple idea very, very seriously. It is not just enough to read about some idea and be impressed with it. When you see that something grabs you, you have to go all in and you have to fight the normal tendency of the status quo.

例如，微软几乎所有的东西都是克隆的。微软在研究实验室上花费了数十亿美元。但却没有任何成果。他们的成功经验是：研究 Lotus 并创造出 Excel，研究 WordPerfect 并创造出 Word，研究 Mac 并创造出 Windows，等等。即使是现在，OpenAl 也是与AI合作。谷歌（在AI方面）做了大量工作，微软没做什么工作，但他们却领先了。山姆-沃尔顿是另一位伟大的克隆者。事实上，好市多的前首席执行官詹姆斯-西内格尔（James Sinegal）就是从他曾经的同事索-普莱斯（Sol Price）那里克隆了整个模式。有人问他："你从索尔-普赖斯那里学到了什么？"他的回答是："这是问错了。我所知道的一切都是从 Sol Price 那里学来的。我所知道的一切都来自于Sol Price"。这些人非常、非常认真地对待一个简单的想法。仅仅读到一些想法并对其印象深刻是不够的。当你看到某个东西抓住了你的心，你就必须全力以赴，你必须与想要维持现状的倾向做斗争。

Both Charlie and Warren, their success has come from the dogged pursuit of a few very simple ideas. For example, when they bought See's Candies in the 70s in California, it was a huge jump for them. They paid three times the book value for the company. They thought they were paying too much, and they didn't understand how good a business it was. The only thing Warren did every year was he left the management alone to run the business. However, on January 1st of each year, he changed all the prices significantly above the rate of inflation. For instance, if inflation was  , he would raise the price  , and the next year it was 3 or  , he would raise another  . What surprised him was he kept pounding in these very heavy price increases and unit volumes kept going up. It stunned him that you could have a business with this much pricing power. Both Warren and Charlie did not understand brands and did not understand the power of brands, but they became very ardent students of "What was this phenomenon? What did this mean? How can we apply this in other businesses?" Today, we see that it was fundamental to Berkshire, because it was, again, looking at a relatively simple idea, but trying to get your arms around it. Many of us start businesses because we see an offering gap. We see some product or service that should exist in the world but doesn't, or maybe there is not enough of it, so we go into it. Once we take that plunge, having this notion of the dogged pursuit of simple ideas will lead to a lot of good things.

无论是查理还是沃伦，他们的成功都源于对一些简单想法的执着追求。例如，70 年代他们在加利福尼亚收购 See's 糖果公司时，对他们来说是一次巨大的跳跃。他们为这家公司支付了三倍于账面价值的价格。他们认为自己花的钱太多了，而且他们并不了解这家公司的业务有多好。沃伦每年做的唯一一件事，就是让管理层独自经营公司。不过，在每年1月1日，他会上调所有价格，提价幅度远高于通胀增速。例如，如果通货膨胀率是3%，他就会把价格提高10%，第二年是3%或4% ，他就会再提高10%。让他惊讶的是，他不断地大幅提价，单位销量却不断上升。这让他惊呆了，原来企业可以有这么大的定价权。沃伦和查理都不了解品牌，也不了解品牌的力量，但他们都非常热衷于研究 "这是什么现象？这意味着什么？我们如何将其应用到其他业务中？今天，我们看到，这对伯克希尔公司来说是至关重要的，因为这同样是在研究一个相对简单的想法，但却要努力去掌握它。我们中的许多人创办企业，是因为看到了市场空白。我们看到一些产品或服务应该存在于这个世界上，但却没有，或者可能还不够多，于是我们就投入其中。一旦我们下定决心，坚持不懈地追求简单的想法，就会有很多好的结果。

Robert:   Charlie kept the bust of Ben Franklin, didn't he?

罗伯特   查理保留了本-富兰克林的半身像，是吗？

Mohnish: Yes. Mohnish: 是的。

Robert: Can you talk about his connection? How did he feel connected to Ben Franklin? Can you talk about how he looked up to Ben Franklin? I would love to hear your thoughts on that and what Ben Franklin meant to Charlie.

罗伯特：你能谈谈他的联系吗？他觉得自己与本-富兰克林有什么联系？你能谈谈他是如何仰慕本-富兰克林的吗？我很想听听你的想法，以及本-富兰克林对查理的意义。

Mohnish: Ben Franklin is a person very much worth studying. Many of us are familiar with Ben Franklin, the founder of the United States. But Walter Isaacson wrote a very good biography of Ben Franklin. He is the same guy who wrote the biographies of Steve Jobs and Elon Musk. The overdosing on Franklin, which is a simple idea taken seriously is a good thing. Many aspects of Franklin would resonate with YPOers because Franklin started as an entrepreneur. He had a printing and a publishing business, and he yearned for financial independence, independence of thought, and all kinds of independence. In his early forties, he sold his business to his apprentice with no money. We can say changing hands at the time. He told his apprentice, "You just pay me a percentage of the profits over the next few decades." It was a win-win for both sides. Once he freed himself from running a business, he could focus on bigger things. Franklin was a polymath. He invented so many things like bifocals and the lightning rod, and he figured out electricity and so many other things. He was a philosopher. Without him, there is no United States. He was very central to getting France to support the United States against England by sending troops. If you think about it, one monarchy was going to fight another monarchy to help the foundation of a democracy. It just does not make any sense on the surface, but the French came through, sided with the Americans, fought the British, and led to the independence of the colonials and the foundation and formation of America. He was also very pragmatic. The founding fathers are an interesting group and it is worth studying all of them, but they were very different from each other. Franklin had many ideas of what the United States should be. Many of those went by the wayside, but he was practical in the formation of coalitions and compromises to get to the endpoint. Charlie very much appreciated Franklin from the point of view of this creation of independence. Charlie himself yearned to be financially independent. He did not want to be financially independent to buy Ferraris. He wanted financial independence so he could do and say whatever he thought. He was not a servant to anyone. He could pursue all his passions in life. He used to joke and say, "I was always pursuing financial independence, and I overshot a bit." He ended up with a few billion dollars that he did not need, but it is what it is. Many of us joke that Charlie is Ben Franklin reincarnated. If there ever is a reincarnation of Ben Franklin, it would have been Charlie Munger.

莫尼什：本-富兰克林是一个非常值得研究的人。我们很多人都熟悉美国的创始人本-富兰克林。但沃尔特-艾萨克森（Walter Isaacson）写了一本非常好的本-富兰克林传记。就是他写了史蒂夫-乔布斯（Steve Jobs）和埃隆-马斯克（Elon Musk）的传记。认真对待富兰克林这个简单的想法是件好事。富兰克林的许多方面都会引起 YPO 人士的共鸣，因为富兰克林是以企业家的身份起家的。他做过印刷和出版生意，渴望经济独立、思想独立和各种独立。在他四十出头的时候，他把自己的生意卖给了他的学徒，而且分文不取。我们当时可以说是易手。他对徒弟说："你只需在未来几十年里按一定比例向我支付利润。"这对双方来说都是双赢。一旦他从经营企业中解脱出来他就能专注于更大的事业，富兰克林是个多面手他发明了很多东西，比如双光眼镜和避雷针，他还发明了电和其他很多东西。他是一位哲学家。没有他，就没有美国。他是促使法国出兵支持美国对抗英国的核心人物。仔细想想，一个君主国要与另一个君主国作战，以帮助建立一个民主国家。从表面上看，这根本说不通，但是法国人挺身而出，站在美国人一边，与英国人作战，促成了殖民地的独立以及美国的建立和形成。他还非常务实。开国元勋是一个有趣的群体，值得对他们所有人进行研究，但他们彼此之间存在很大差异。富兰克林有许多关于美国应该是什么样的想法。其中许多想法都被搁置一旁，但他在建立联盟和达成妥协以实现最终目标方面非常务实。从创造独立的角度来看，查理非常欣赏富兰克林。查理本人也渴望经济独立。他不想为了买法拉利而经济独立。他希望经济独立，这样他就可以做任何事，说任何话。他不是任何人的仆人。他可以追求生活中的一切激情。他常开玩笑说："我一直在追求经济独立，结果有点过头了。"他最终拥有了自己并不需要的几十亿美元，但这就是事实。我们很多人开玩笑说，查理是本-富兰克林转世。如果有本-富兰克林转世的话，那一定是查理-芒格。

独立是规避噪音的最有效方法，长期处于噪音的环境中要分清好坏对错是不能想象的，认为可以的肯定是幻觉。

They are very similar in a lot of their attributes. When I met Buffett for lunch, I had asked him, "Mr. Buffett, if you could meet anyone living or dead for lunch, who would you like to meet?" He said, "First I would like to meet Sophia Lauren." He was always a big fan of Sophia Lauren. Then he said, "No, no, no. Scratch that answer. I want to meet Isaac Newton. If I could, I would love to have had lunch with Isaac Newton." I said, "Why do you pick Newton out of all the people you could have picked to have lunch with?" He said, "Well, Newton invented calculus. Newton probably was the smartest human who ever lived. Newton was the smartest, but Franklin was the wisest. My meeting with Newton would be along the lines of, he got swept up into the euphoria of the South Sea bubble. He lost his fortune when he first saw the bubble and the foolishness of the bubble. He then participated in the bubble himself and lost his fortune. That would be my line of inquiry." Out of a mind that wonderful, the mind goes adrift, but Franklin was clearly the wisest, and Charlie was up there. I never met a man who was wiser or smarter than Charlie. There is a big difference in IQ level and wisdom even between Warren and Charlie. No comparison.

他们在很多特质上都非常相似。当我和巴菲特共进午餐时，我曾问他："巴菲特先生，如果你能和任何在世或已故的人共进午餐，你会想见谁？"他说："首先我想见见索菲亚-劳伦。"他一直是索菲亚-劳伦的超级粉丝然后他说："不，不，不。划掉这个答案。我想见艾萨克-牛顿。如果可以，我真想和艾萨克-牛顿共进午餐。"我说："你为什么要选牛顿？" 他说："牛顿是个伟大的科学家"他说："牛顿发明了微积分。牛顿可能是有史以来最聪明的人。牛顿是最聪明的，但富兰克林是最有智慧的。我和牛顿的会面应该是这样的：他被南海泡沫的兴奋冲昏了头脑。当他第一次看到泡沫和泡沫的愚蠢时，他倾家荡产。然后，他自己也参与了泡沫，结果倾家荡产。这就是我的调查方向"。"从一个奇妙的思想中走出来，思想就会漂泊不定，但富兰克林显然是最聪明的，查理也在其列。我从未见过比查理更聪明的人。即使在沃伦和查理之间，智商水平和智慧也有很大差距。没有可比性。

Robert: Can you talk more about that and how Charlie changed Warren's thought processes on investing over the years?

罗伯特：你能更多地谈谈这一点吗，以及这些年来查理是如何改变沃伦的投资思维方式的？

Mohnish: In the Berkshire annual letter this year, if you go to berkshirehathaway.com and pull up the letter and read it, Warren has a one-page tribute to Charlie. He talks about how Charlie is the architect of Berkshire, and Warren is the general contractor. He said that Berkshire was built to the blueprint of Charlie. Warren was trained under Ben Graham. He was heavily influenced by Ben Graham. Ben Graham's entire investing framework came out of the depression and came out of the market crash. He went looking for the stocks that were most widely mispriced, the cheapest stocks because he was always concerned about not losing and reducing risk. Charlie, in some of his early adventures in business, realized that some businesses just gave you one difficult decision after another, and other businesses were so easy to run, and they made a lot of money. There was no real correlation between how difficult a business was and how much money you made. In fact, there was an inverse correlation. He told Warren, "You made a big mistake buying Berkshire Hathaway, but I am going to try to help you fix it. Rather than buying a fair business at a good price, you need to buy good businesses at a fair price." That is a huge transition for someone like Buffett, who has so much respect for Ben Graham. He also used an approach created by Ben Graham to compound money at very high rates, into the thirties per year. For someone to give up something that worked so well for him and move in the direction of Charlie Munger was because of the power of Charlie's mind. Charlie was remarkable in the sense that he let Warren come to the other side at his own pace. He never criticized him for any decisions he made. Warren till today has very deeply embedded in him the bargain hunter, which surfaces from time to time. Charlie would see that, but he would not rub it in his face.

莫尼什：在伯克希尔今年的年度信件中，如果你访问 berkshirehathaway.com 并调出信件阅读，沃伦有一页是向查理致敬的。他谈到查理是伯克希尔的建筑师，而沃伦是总承包商。他说，伯克希尔是按照查理的蓝图建造的。沃伦师从本-格雷厄姆。他深受本-格雷厄姆的影响。本-格雷厄姆的整个投资框架是在大萧条和市场崩溃中形成的。他去寻找那些被广泛错误定价的股票、最便宜的股票，因为他始终关注不亏损和降低风险。查理在他早期的一些商业冒险中意识到，有些企业只会让你做出一个又一个艰难的决定，而另一些企业却很容易经营，还能赚大钱。生意难做与赚钱多少之间并没有真正的关联。事实上，两者之间存在着反比关系。他告诉沃伦："你收购伯克希尔-哈撒韦公司犯了一个大错，但我会尽力帮你弥补。而不是你需要以合理的价格购买合理的企业"。对于像巴菲特这样非常尊敬本-格雷厄姆的人来说，这是一个巨大的转变。他还使用了本-格雷厄姆创造的一种方法，以非常高的复利率，每年复利高达 30%。对于一个人来说，放弃对他非常有效的方法，转而投向查理-芒格的怀抱，是因为查理的思想力量。查理的非凡之处在于，他让沃伦按照自己的节奏走向彼岸。他从不批评沃伦做出的任何决定。直到今天，沃伦身上还深深地烙着讨价还价的烙印，这种烙印时不时地会浮现出来。查理会看到这一点，但不会当着他的面说出来。

It was interesting because what I noticed with Charlie is he was on the board of Costco for almost three decades. I know that all the institutions whose boards and stuff he got involved with, like the Harvard Westlake School in Los Angeles, or the UCSB or Stanford, or the University of Michigan, improved. But the interesting thing about his finesse was he was able to improve them without the institutions feeling that he was imposing on them. He kind of cajoled them into a direction without them even realizing that they were being cajoled in a particular direction. I met James Sinegal, the founder of Costco, at the Charlie Memorial on March 10th. The family had a memorial for him in LA, a wonderful ceremony. James Sinegal spoke at the memorial. I asked him, "Charlie was on the board for three decades. What can you point to that is different at Costco than if Charlie was not there?" He could not think of anything and the reason he could not think of anything is because Charlie pushed them into an area in such a subtle manner that they think it is their ideas. He always pushed them to think long-term. Costco is not a retailer. It is a buying agent for the customer. It is a very different mindset and he reinforced that and the reinforcements took place in such a manner that they do not even realize that there was an influence, which is so beautiful.

这很有趣，因为我注意到查理在好市多董事会工作了近三十年。我知道，他所参与的所有机构，如洛杉矶的哈佛西湖学校、加州大学伯克利分校或斯坦福大学、密歇根大学等，其董事会和相关事务都得到了改善。但他的手腕有趣的地方在于，他能够在改善这些机构的同时，不让它们觉得他是在强加给它们。他以一种劝说的方式将它们引向一个方向，而它们甚至没有意识到自己被劝说到了一个特定的方向。3 月 10 日，我在查理纪念馆见到了好市多（Costco）的创始人詹姆斯-西内格尔（James Sinegal）。他的家人在洛杉矶为他举行了一个悼念仪式，仪式非常精彩。詹姆斯-西内格尔在悼念仪式上发表了讲话。我问他："查理在董事会工作了三十年。你能指出 Costco 与查理不在时有什么不同吗？他想不出任何东西，而他想不出任何东西的原因是查理以一种非常微妙的方式将他们推向了一个领域，以至于他们认为这是他们的想法。他总是促使他们进行长远思考。好市多不是零售商。它是顾客的采购代理。这是一种截然不同的思维方式，他强化了这种思维方式，而且强化的方式让他们甚至没有意识到这种影响，这真是太美妙了。

Costco的成功应该有一个非常聪明的假设（Intelligent hypotheses）。

Robert: Speaking of mindset, When Charlie made decisions, he had mental models that he would talk about. Can you talk about Charlie's mental models and how he made decisions?

罗伯特：说到思维模式，查理在做决定时，会谈到他的心智模式。你能谈谈查理的心智模式以及他是如何做决定的吗？

Mohnish: He was a very prolific reader. I would guess that Charlie was reading maybe 200 to 500 books a year in a wide variety of subjects. Sometimes I would go to see him and he would be reading a book on global warming. Many times I had seen him reading a physics book. He had a very wide range of interests. Two things were very amazing about Charlie's brain. One was that Charlie, from all that reading and experience, had etched into his brain certain mental models about the way the world works which would maybe sometimes not be the way we would think they were. For example, the model I gave you about humans having an aversion to cloning would not be something that you would normally conclude. There is another mental model, for example, which is the human tendency for reciprocation. When we lived in hunter-gatherer societies and small groups, and some guy had a very successful hunt and brought down a big beast to his community, he would store the beef or the meat in the bellies of his neighbors because there was no refrigeration. He would think to himself, "What are you going to do? You cannot eat the meat yourself, and you cannot store it, so it is going to spoil." What he would do is he would call all his neighbors, and they would have a great feast, and everyone would remember that Joe is a good

莫尼什：他是一个非常多产的读者。我猜查理每年大概要读 200 到 500 本不同主题的书。有时我去看他，他会在读一本关于全球变暖的书。有很多次，我看到他在读一本物理书。他的兴趣非常广泛。关于查理的大脑，有两件事非常令人惊讶。其一是，查理从所有的阅读和经验中，在他的大脑中刻下了关于世界运行方式的某些心理模型，这些模型有时可能与我们想象的不一样。例如，我给你的关于人类厌恶克隆的模型，就不是你通常会得出的结论。例如，还有另一种心理模式，即人类的互惠倾向。当我们生活在狩猎采集社会和小群体中时，如果某个人打猎非常成功，给他的群体带来了一头大野兽，他会把牛肉或肉储存在邻居的肚子里，因为当时没有冷藏设备。他会想："你打算怎么办？你不能自己吃肉 也不能储存肉 所以肉会变质"他会做的就是召集所有的邻居，他们会大吃一顿，每个人都会记住乔是个好人

guy because Joe shared his spoils with them. Later, when Frank would have a big beast that he would bring down, Joe would be invited for sure to the feast. Reciprocation in humans, Charlie believed, was etched into our brains from the times of hunter-gatherer. But there is a quirk. The thing is that the mental model that got etched into our brains does not have a calibration engine. What that means is that if I do you a favor, all you know is Mohnish is a good guy. Mohnish did me a favor. You are not able to calibrate how big a favor did he do. You just have good feelings about Mohnish. When you do not have a calibration engine and you just feel good about somebody, salesmen take advantage of this particular quirk in human cognitive thinking.

因为乔和他们分享了他的战利品。后来，当弗兰克捕到一头大野兽时，乔一定会被邀请参加盛宴。查理相信，从狩猎采集时代开始，人类的大脑中就有了互惠的观念。但有一个怪癖。问题在于，刻入我们大脑的心理模型并没有校准引擎。也就是说，如果我帮了你一个忙，你只知道莫尼什是个好人。莫尼什帮了我一个忙。你无法校准他帮了多大的忙。你只是对莫尼什有好感。当你没有校准引擎，只是对某人有好感时，推销员就会利用人类认知思维中的这一特殊怪癖。

I have taken advantage of it when I have built my business. For example, if someone approaches Pabrai Investment Funds and says, "Hey, I am interested in your funds. Can you send me some information?" What most of my competitors do is send everything digitally because it is efficient. We send it digitally as well, but we also send a physical package. In the physical package, there are some goodies in there. There is a very nice cross pen, and there is a book and a few other things. The minimum investment is a few million dollars. When the recipient gets my pen, which is a very nice pen, they feel obligated in some way. The only way to kind of equalize that obligation is to wire a few million dollars. If they do not wire a few million dollars, returning that pen is complicated. They will need to package it and send it to the post office. If I send out a hundred of these packages, maybe one or two out of a couple of hundred come back saying, "Thank you for your package. I do not have an interest in the services of the fund. Warm regards." But   do not come back, and those   feel good about Mohnish, and a decent percentage of them wire the money. It is   one way and a few million the other way because there is no calibration engine. Charlie had probably 50 to 100 of these models, maybe more. What was so fantastic about Charlie's brain is he had these models in his brain, and I have never seen any other human who can do this, which is why there are no humans with Charlie's brainpower. I would bring up something to him like some new stock or problem I am having with Dakshana Foundation, and he has instantly correlated three models and gives the answer. His ability to have these models in his brain and to know which three applied and how they interact with each other when they apply together, is a talent. I am a very juvenile kind of practitioner of that. Charlie was the Kung Fu master. He was a Yoda on that front, and it gave him a big advantage. Warren said that Charlie had the best mind to analyze any business. Anytime he brought up any business to him, he was so fast. Mainly he was fast at getting to a no and getting to a no for at least one good reason very quickly. So it took away a lot of noise from his life.

我在建立自己的业务时利用了这一点。例如，如果有人找到 Pabrai Investment Funds 说："嘿，我对你们的基金感兴趣。你能给我发一些信息吗？我的大多数竞争对手都是以数字方式发送信息，因为这样效率高。我们也以数字方式发送，但我们也发送实体包裹。在实物包裹里，还有一些好东西。有一支非常漂亮的十字笔，还有一本书和其他一些东西。最低投资额为几百万美元。当收件人收到我的笔--一支非常漂亮的笔时，他们会觉得自己有某种义务。唯一能平衡这种义务的办法就是汇几百万美元。如果他们不汇几百万美元，归还那支笔就很复杂。他们需要包装好，然后寄到邮局。如果我寄出一百个这样的包裹，也许几百个包裹中会有一两个回来说："谢谢你的包裹。我对基金的服务没有兴趣。致以亲切的问候"。但是，98%、99%人没有回来，而那些98%、99%人对莫尼希感觉良好，其中相当一部分人汇了钱。因为没有校准引擎，所以一方花了50美元，另一方则是几百万美元。查理大概有 50 到 100 个这样的模型，也许更多。查理大脑的奇妙之处在于，他的大脑里有这些模型，我从未见过任何其他人能做到这一点，这也是为什么没有人拥有查理这样的脑力。我会向他提出一些问题，比如一些新股票或者我在达克萨纳基金会遇到的问题，而他会立即将三个模型关联起来，并给出答案。 他能够在大脑中拥有这些模型，并知道哪三个模型适用，以及当它们一起适用时如何相互影响，这是一种才能。在这方面，我是一个非常稚嫩的练习者。查理是功夫大师。他是这方面的尤达，这给了他很大的优势。沃伦说，查理拥有分析任何业务的最佳头脑。每当他向他提出任何业务时，他的反应都非常快。最主要的是，他很快就能拒绝，而且至少有一个很好的理由。因此，这为他的生活增添了许多乐趣。

利用人性做生意，巴菲特在2024年的股东大会里批评了这个做法，《2024-05-04 Berkshire Hathaway Annual Meeting》，He believed in understanding what others would do, but he thought it was beneath him to actually use those methods to manipulate people.，这个印度人一开始想给巴菲特免费打工，巴菲特没有收，但把他介绍给了芒格。

Robert:   Speaking of bringing businesses to him for his feedback, you made some investments in companies in Turkey, years back when it was not on anyone's radar. I am curious, did you run those by Charlie? If not, it would be great to hear some of the things that you did run by Charlie and his thoughts.

罗伯特：说到把企业介绍给他听取他的反馈意见，你在土耳其投资了一些公司，那是几年前的事了，当时还没有人注意到土耳其。我很好奇，你向查理汇报过这些投资吗？如果没有，我很想听听查理对你所做投资的看法。

Mohnish: Every time I brought up Turkey to him, Charlie was very negative. He would instantly say "I do not want to do that. I do not want to hear about it." But I persisted with Charlie. We own a Coke bottler in Turkey. I know Charlie knows the Coke business well because they are huge shareholders in Coke. I said, "Charlie, tell me how I am going to lose money on this one." He replied,

莫尼什：每次我向他提起土耳其，查理都很消极。他会立刻说："我不想这么做。我不想听"。但我坚持跟查理说。我们在土耳其拥有一家可乐装瓶厂。我知道查理很了解可乐业务，因为他们是可乐的大股东。我说："查理，告诉我这次我怎么会赔钱。"他回答说：

"It is going to work." I said, "But you were so negative." He said, "No, that is going to work. That is fine." I saw him kind of shift. His thoughts on something like Turkey were that it would be so much work for him to take that leap, to do the work, to make the trips. I then thought that I was going to focus because we are in a business with no called strikes." It is not like baseball; three strikes and you are out. You can let a thousand good pitches go by. If Charlie says "no" to Turkey, and Turkey does well, it does not matter. What matters is that he should not be saying "yes" to something that does not do well. That is kind of how he thought about it. Regarding Turkey, I finally got him to move a little bit. That was okay.

"会成功的"我说，"但你太消极了"，他说："不，会成功的。"很好"我看到他在转变他对土耳其这样的事情的想法是，对他来说，要实现这一飞跃，要做这些工作，需要去拜访几次，是一件非常辛苦的事情。然后我就想，我要集中精力，因为我们从事的是一个没有三振出局的行业"。这不像棒球，三振出局。你可以让无数个好球擦身而过。如果查理对土耳其说 "不"，而土耳其表现出色，这并不重要。重要的是，他不应该对做得不好的事情说 "好"。他就是这么想的。关于土耳其，我终于让他动了一下。还行。

Robert: Can you talk about his sense of humor? I heard something that even when he got to the hospital his last time, he still had a sense of humor.

Mohnish: He joked with the nurse. The nurse asked him, "How are you?" He said, "Oh, I am dying. How about you?" Exactly one month before Charlie passed away, I had my last dinner with him. I did not know it was going to be my last time seeing him. It was one-on-one, just him and me on a Saturday at his home. Of course, his mind was very sharp, but he was telling me there were a lot of things wrong with his body. The day before he passed away when he was in the hospital, he was trying to close one last grant to a nonprofit. I do not think Charlie had a belief in God. He was agnostic. He did not believe there was something after death; he believed this was it.

莫尼什：他和护士开玩笑。护士问他 "你好吗？"他说："哦，我快死了。你呢？"就在查理去世前一个月，我最后一次和他共进晚餐。我不知道这将是我最后一次见到他。那是一对一的，只有我和他，在一个周六，在他家里。当然，他的思维非常敏锐，但他告诉我，他的身体出了很多问题。他去世前一天还在医院里，当时他正试图为一家非营利组织完成最后一笔捐赠。我不认为查理信仰上帝。他是不可知论者。他不相信死后会有什么，他相信今生就是一切。

In an interview he gave about a month before he passed away they asked him, "What would you like written on your gravestone if someone were to put something?" He said, "I tried to be useful." I tried to be useful is exactly a simple idea that he took very seriously. He extracted everything he could from his mind and his body till the last day. On the last day, his family is with him, but he is still trying to help some non-profits do better. There is no upside to him doing that. He is not trying to publicize that. There is no legacy or anything. It is just a selfless act. And even with Warren, the relationship was built because of so many selfless acts. There is a book that I do not think Charlie ever read, by Adam Grant called Give and Take. It is a great book to read. Adam Grant said that there are three kinds of people in this world, the givers, the takers, and the matchers. The givers are the people who are always trying to do things for others without any scorecard or anything in return. They just want to help you. There is no need to explain what a taker is. You just want to have nothing to do with a taker. They just want to extract from you and never give anything back. They are selfish people. The matchers think they are smart. For example, a matcher would say, "Robert did X for me so I am going to do exactly X for him." What Adam pointed out in his book is that the givers end up owning the world because there is so much goodwill they generate with all the people around them. Charlie never read that book, but Charlie was a giver. He never tried to think about what was in it for him. What is he going to get out of this? I will tell you a funny story that has a couple of very beautiful lessons. I used to play bridge with Charlie at the LA Country Club. He would play on Fridays and one or two times a month I would meet him and his friends for bridge. Usually, we would have lunch starting at about 12.30 at the LA Country Club in the dining room. They had very nice food and ambiance. Then we would go off to play bridge for three, or four hours. Once I was sitting on a table for four. Across from me were Charlie Munger and Rick Guerin. They were very close friends. Rick was the one who brought See's candies to their attention. I told the

在他去世前一个月接受采访时，他们问他："如果有人要在你的墓碑上写点什么，你希望写什么？"他说："我努力成为一个有用的人。""我努力成为有用的人 "这个简单的想法，他却非常认真地对待。直到最后一天，他都在榨取自己身心所能榨取的一切。在最后一天，他的家人和他在一起，但他仍在努力帮助一些非营利组织做得更好。他这样做没有任何好处。他并没有试图宣传这一点。没有任何遗产或其他东西。这只是一种无私的行为。即使是与沃伦的关系，也是因为许多无私的行为而建立起来的。亚当-格兰特（Adam Grant）写过一本书，叫《付出与收获》，我想查理应该没读过。这本书很值得一读。亚当-格兰特说，这个世界上有三种人，给予者（giver）、索取者（taker）和互利者（matcher）。给予者是那些总是努力为他人做事的人，他们没有任何记分卡或任何回报。他们只想帮助你。没有必要解释什么是索取者。你只想与索取者毫无瓜葛。他们只想从你身上榨取，却从不回报。他们是自私的人。互利者自以为聪明。例如，互利者会说："罗伯特为我做了X，所以我也要为他做X"。亚当在书中指出，施惠者最终会拥有整个世界，因为他们与周围的人产生了太多的善意。查理从来没有读过这本书，但查理是一个给予者。他从不去想这对他有什么好处。他能从中得到什么？我给你们讲一个有趣的故事，其中蕴含着一些非常美好的道理。我曾经和查理在洛杉矶乡村俱乐部打桥牌。 他每周五都会打桥牌，我每月会和他及他的朋友们打一两次桥牌。通常，我们会在 12:30 左右开始在洛杉矶乡村俱乐部的餐厅共进午餐。那里的食物和环境都很不错。然后我们会去打三个或四个小时的桥牌。有一次，我坐在一张四人桌上。我的对面是查理-芒格和里克-盖林。他们是非常要好的朋友。是里克让他们注意到了See's糖果我告诉

（瑞克·盖林，Rick Guerin，伯克希尔早期合伙人之一，三人曾一起拜访企业，做投资决定。1973-1974年，美国股市2年内重挫70%，盖林因使用保证金融资而被迫将持有的伯克希尔股份卖给巴菲特。盖林是芒格长期挚友，任每日期刊董事会副主席。）

two of them, "You guys think this is just a bridge game, just a lunch, but I want to tell you guys that this is an iconic moment. Some yo-yo Indian guy from some of the suburbs of Mumbai is sitting with two massive historic icons. I know you guys do not think that is the case, but that is how it is for me. tell me about one of the more interesting deals when you guys were in the sixties shooting fish in a barrel after the water had been run out with all the deals you guys were doing,

其中两个人说："你们以为这只是一场桥牌比赛，只是一顿午餐，但我想告诉你们，这是一个标志性的时刻。来自孟买郊区的一个随随便便的印度人，却与两个重要历史人物坐在一起。我知道你们不这么认为，但对我来说就是这样。给我讲讲你们在 60 年代做的一桩更有趣的交易吧，在水都快干了的“桶里射鱼”（形容60年代时市场竞争小，收购交易很容易做）、

The two of them look at each other and Rick Guerin tells him, "Tell him about that redhead nurse." Charlie's language always with me was very colorful. I do not think we went three sentences without the F word and Charlie says, "Oh, yes Rick, that is a good story." He then tells me, "There was this maverick entrepreneur in Southern California, who had come up with this liquid adhesive you could pour into your radiator if there was a leak, and it would automatically seal any leaks. To build sales, what the guy did was he used to go to different auto repair shops, call the mechanics, and then pull out his gun and shoot a hole in his car's radiator, and then pour the liquid and show them that there was no leak. That is how he built sales. This guy passes away with a heart attack. The wife who is grieving, finds out that the executor of his will is this redhead nurse who he was having an affair with that she did not even know about. He left the business and all the assets to the wife, but he made the mistress the executor of the will. Both women were pissed off at each other. The business itself was bankrupt. They had some debt, and it did not have any value beyond the debt." Charlie and Rick wanted to buy the business. Two   notes were owed to two aunts of the wife. They could have bought those notes at a discount from those two women. The equity did not have any value. They could have maybe a hundred thousand instead of 160,000. But Charlie told Rick that they should not take advantage of these women and that they should pay full price for them. He talked to the wife and he talked to the two aunts, and he said, "Look, we would like to buy the business. It does not have much value. We pay 80,000 to each of you, and we need you to sign off on it. We also need the nurse to cooperate as well because she is the executor of the will." The nurse was not willing to sign off on anything. She was not going to get anything, and she was pissed off. Charlie arranged to meet the nurse at the California Club for lunch. He had never met her before. He wanted to smooth the feathers and explain to her that this was the right thing to do. The California Club is a very kind of blue-blood old institution with big ceilings. Charlie always sat in the same dining table. I met him for the first time at the California Club. She came directly from work in her nurse's uniform, which was one size too small for her. Everyone in the dining room thinks that Charlie is having lunch with a porn star and they are aghast. They were all thinking that this was Mr. Munger. He is a very honorable citizen of Los Angeles. What is he doing with a porn star? Charlie himself is surprised at the way she appears. Anyway, Charlie says, "I kind of controlled myself. I tried to control my eyes. I pacified her, and we got the deal done." They bought the business for 160,000 and they got it done.

他们俩互相看了一眼，里克-格瑞恩告诉他 "跟他说说那个红发护士"，查理对我的语言总是非常丰富多彩。我觉得我们说了三句话都没提到 "F "这个词，查理说："哦，是的，里克，这是个好故事。"然后他告诉我："南加州有一位特立独行的企业家，他发明了一种液体粘合剂，如果散热器漏水，你可以把这种粘合剂倒进散热器里，它就会自动密封漏水处。为了扩大销售，这个人经常去不同的汽车修理店，给技工打电话，然后掏出枪，在汽车散热器上打一个洞，然后倒入液体，向他们证明没有泄漏。这就是他的销售方式。这家伙心脏病发作去世了。悲痛欲绝的妻子发现，遗嘱的执行人是一位红发护士，而她甚至不知道他和这位红发护士有染。他把生意和所有资产都留给了妻子，却让情妇成为遗嘱执行人。两个女人都很生气。企业本身已经破产。"他们欠了一些债，除了债务，企业没有任何价值。"查理和里克想买下这家公司。有两张 8万票据是欠妻子的两个姑姑的。他们本可以从这两位女士手中以折扣价买下这些票据。股权没有任何价值。他们也许可以得到十万，而不是十六万。但查理告诉里克，他们不应该占这些女人的便宜，他们应该出全价买下它们。他跟里克的妻子和两位姑姑谈了谈，然后说："听着，我们想买下这家公司。它没有多少价值。我们付给你们每人 8 万，需要你们签字同意。 我们还需要护士的配合，因为她是遗嘱的执行人"。护士不愿意签字。她什么也得不到，她很生气。查理安排在加利福尼亚俱乐部与护士共进午餐。他以前从未见过她。他想抚平她的情绪，向她解释这样做是正确的。加利福尼亚俱乐部是一家高贵而古老的老机构，天花板很大。查理总是坐在同一张餐桌上。我第一次见到他就是在加州俱乐部。她穿着护士服直接从公司赶来，那件制服对她来说太小了。餐厅里的每个人都以为查理在和一个色情明星共进午餐，他们都惊呆了。他们都以为这是芒格先生。他是洛杉矶一位非常体面的公民。他怎么会和一个艳星在一起？查理自己也对她出现的方式感到惊讶。总之，查理说："我控制住了自己。我试着控制自己的眼神。"我安抚了她 我们完成了交易"他们花了16万买下了那家公司 他们完成了交易。

Two years after that Rick Guerin needed money and they owned the business 50-50. He told Charlie, "Listen, I need a couple of hundred thousand and I am tight and I want to sell you this business. You can take over a hundred percent of it." Charlie asked him, "What do you think it is worth? What is your portion worth?" Rick says, "My portion is worth

两年后，里克-格瑞恩需要钱，他们的生意五五分成。他告诉查理："听着，我需要几十万 我手头很紧，我想把这生意卖给你你可以占百分之百的股份。"查理问他："你觉得它值多少钱？你那部分值多少钱？"里克说："我那部分值

200,000." Charlie says, "No, you are wrong. Your portion is worth 300,000, and here is the cheque for 300,000 ." He did not take advantage of those two women. He paid them a full price even though he did not know them. He also did not take advantage of Rick Guerin. Think about it. A seller is proposing a selling price, and you are proposing to pay   above the selling price the seller is proposing. That is how Charlie was. He always wanted to make sure that if you did business with him, you felt like you got the better end of the deal. Once you do something like that for Rick, you have cemented a friendship and trust and everything else for a lifetime and beyond. Rick will do anything for him now. I found the story funny, but that story has many good lessons for us. In business, when we think about things in that context of win-win as opposed to transactional, we get a lot of tailwinds.

200,000."查理说："不，你错了。你那份价值 30 万，这是 30 万的支票。"他没有占那两个女人的便宜。尽管他并不认识她们，但他还是付给了她们全价。他也没有占里克-盖林的便宜。想一想吧。卖方提出了一个售价，而你提出支付高于卖方提出的售价的   。查理就是这样的人。他总是想确保，如果你和他做生意，你会觉得你得到了更好的交易。一旦你为里克做了这样的事，你就巩固了友谊和信任，以及一生的其他一切。里克现在会为他做任何事。我觉得这个故事很有趣，但这个故事对我们有很多很好的启示。在商业中，当我们从双赢而不是交易的角度考虑问题时，我们就会得到很多好处。

Robert: 罗伯特

Mohnish: Warren used to always say, "I wanted to be a bookie, but my parents would not approve of it, and so I went into the insurance business." They are both betting personalities; they are gamblers, but they are gamblers in the sense that they only want to bet when the odds are in their favor. They are never going to go and sit down at the table in Vegas or anything. I knew that Charlie had this gambling mindset. I once went to him and said, "Charlie, by the way, I just got banned from this casino in Vegas." I explained to him how I got banned, and I explained to him my system. He had so much fun with that. He loved that because, for him, it was all about these bets where the odds were in your favor. I found an anomaly where this casino had thin odds because their location was off-strip, and they needed to bring people in to come and play there. They had improved the game versus what you would normally find. The game was still in their favor. The average guy playing there would lose money. I had a good relationship with these guys. I had taken them for about 150,000 over a few months. The general manager came and sat around me and said, "Stop dealing to him." Then the dealer was coming to deal, and he got angry. He said, "Right now stop dealing to him." She is taken aback, and then he tells me, "Look, Mohnish, we love you. We enjoy having you. I watched your videos. I read your book. But we cannot have you play Blackjack here anymore." I said, "You guys have problems with card counters. I am not counting cards." He said, "That is what had us confused, because we watched the tape for a while, and it was very clear to us that you were not counting cards. But we figured out that we cannot beat your system, so we are done. You can come to the casino, you can use all the facilities, but you cannot sit down and play Blackjack." I was actually very proud of that because the system worked. That is what I was trying to do. From an hourly pay point of view, I am better off pursuing other pursuits, but it was just fun to do it.

莫尼什：沃伦以前总说："我想当赌徒，但我父母不同意，所以我就去做保险了。他们都是赌徒；他们都是赌徒，但他们是赌徒的意思是，只有当赔率对他们有利时，他们才愿意下注。他们永远不会去拉斯维加斯或其他地方赌一把。我知道查理有这种赌博心态。有一次我对他说："查理，顺便说一句，我刚被拉斯维加斯的赌场封杀了"，我向他解释了我是怎么被禁赛的，还向他解释了我的系统他听得津津有味他很喜欢，因为对他来说，这些赌注都是赔率对你有利的。我发现了一个反常现象，这家赌场的赔率很低，因为他们的地点不在赌城，他们需要吸引人们来这里玩。与通常情况相比，他们改进了游戏。游戏仍然对他们有利。一般人在那里玩都会输钱。我和这些人关系不错。几个月下来，我赢了他们大约 15 万。总经理过来围坐在我身边说 "别再跟他发牌了"，然后经销商来交易，他很生气。他说，"现在就停止跟他交易"。她大吃一惊，然后他告诉我，"听着，莫尼什，我们爱你。我们喜欢你。我看过你的视频。我读过你的书。但我们不能再让你在这里玩二十一点了。"我说："你们有算牌的问题。我没有算牌。"他说："这正是让我们困惑的地方，因为我们看了一会儿录像带，我们很清楚你没有算牌。但我们想明白了，我们不可能打败你的系统，所以我们不玩了。 你可以来赌场，你可以使用所有的设施，但你不能坐下来玩二十一点"。事实上，我对此感到非常自豪，因为这个系统行之有效。这就是我想做的事情。从时薪的角度来看，我最好还是从事其他工作，但这样做很有趣。

Robert: Over the years, Mohnish, what surprised you the most about Charlie?

罗伯特：多年来，莫尼什，查理最让你感到惊讶的是什么？

Mohnish: We know that he was a good businessman, a good investor, and a good partner. He had eight kids. He had so many in-laws, grandkids, and greatgrandkids, with a wide range of personalities. Charlie loved the quote of Ben Franklin that said, "Keep your eyes wide open before you get married, and half shut afterward." What I noticed with him is that he applied a very different kind of framework and mental model in how he dealt with

莫尼什：我们知道他是个好商人、好投资者和好伙伴。他有八个孩子。他有很多姻亲、孙子和重孙子，性格各异。查理很喜欢本-富兰克林说过的一句话："婚前睁大眼睛，婚后闭上眼睛"。我注意到，他在处理以下问题时，采用了一种截然不同的框架和思维模式

different people. I would watch him interact with someone, and then when the person left, he would understand that that person had different quirks. There were a lot of lessons I learned. This was not just some polymath. This was a person who was wise and understood the spectrum of the way humans were and how to navigate around that spectrum. He had seen and figured out a lot of things about different nuances, and it was very helpful to him.

不同的人。我会看着他与某人互动，然后当那个人离开时，他会明白那人的不同寻常之处。我学到了很多东西。他不仅仅是个多面手。他是一个睿智的人，了解人类的各种方式，以及如何在这些方式中游刃有余。他看到并弄清了许多关于不同细微差别的事情，这对他很有帮助。

Robert: 罗伯特

Mohnish: There is a book called Poor Charlie's Almanack. They have come out with a new edition, but the older editions are better. The new edition does not have that many illustrations. At the back of the book, you can see the 11 speeches he gave. There is a lifetime of wisdom in those speeches. If someone went through those speeches and understood them, it would be better than a four-year college degree anywhere. One of those speeches is about the psychology of human misjudgment. He goes through different mental models of how =because of all our evolution, our brains are very far from just purely rational. having a good understanding of exactly how the apparatus between our ears functions gives us a huge leg up. A lot of his wisdom was distilled into those 11 speeches. If I reread them every year, I can swear that I am reading something I have never read before. Some passages I have never read before. Different things kind of dawn on me at different times. That is what I would say is a great way to improve not just as a business leader, but as a spouse, a father, a grandfather, a son, or a daughter.

莫尼什：有一本书叫《穷查理年鉴》。他们出了新版，但旧版更好。新版没有那么多插图。在书的后面，你可以看到他发表的 11 篇演讲。这些演讲蕴含着他一生的智慧。如果有人能读完这些演讲并理解它们，那将比在任何地方获得四年制大学学位都要好。其中一篇演讲是关于人类错误判断的心理学。他通过不同的心理模型来说明，由于我们的进化，我们的大脑远远不是纯粹理性的。他的很多智慧都浓缩在这 11 篇演讲中。如果我每年都重读这些讲话，我可以发誓，我读到了一些以前从未读过的东西。有些段落我以前从未读过。在不同的时间，不同的东西会让我恍然大悟。我想说的是，这不仅是提高商业领袖地位的好方法，也是提高配偶、父亲、祖父、儿子或女儿地位的好方法。

Robert: 罗伯特

I would like to open up for questions if anyone has questions at this time. Bruce Bendell says, "You have been in YPO for over 25 years. What, if anything, did Charlie think about YPO?

如果大家现在有问题，我想请大家提问。

Mohnish: Both Charlie and Warren were not members of YPO. Warren used to joke and say, "I keep telling them, make an age exception for me. Let me in, but they will not." They both had a lot of respect for YPO. They both spoke to YPO on multiple occasions, and one time I discussed YPO directly with Charlie, and he said it is a wonderful organization with a great mission, and it is good. They understood it, and they were right on that.

莫尼什：查理和沃伦都不是YPO的成员。沃伦经常开玩笑说："我一直告诉他们，给我一个年龄例外。让我加入，但他们不会。他们都非常尊重YPO。他们都曾多次与YPO交谈，有一次我直接与查理讨论YPO，他说这是一个了不起的组织，有伟大的使命，它很好。他们理解这一点，而且他们说得很对。

Robert: Boaz Gilad has a question. He asks, “How did Charlie manage the amount of money that he left behind?”

Mohnish: Charlie's wife had an accident. She fell backward down the stairs at their home in Minnesota. She suffered for maybe a year or 18 months. She had a lot of surgeries and then passed away. She had always wanted half their assets to go to their eight children, and it just so happened that the year she died was the only year in the US tax code when there was no estate tax. There was a quirk in the way the taxes were done. It just happened that she died that year. At that time, Charlie's net worth was about 2 billion or so. This happened in 2010. He passed on about 125 million to each of his kids at that time in Berkshire stock, which would probably be worth around 400 million or something now. The kids have done amazing things from a philanthropic point of view. They did very impressive things. They have done very differently from each other. The other half, he used to tell me that he was just focused on giving it away. He made quite a few different grants. 

莫尼什：查理的妻子出了意外她在明尼苏达州的家中从楼梯上摔了下来。她大概承受了一年或 18 个月的痛苦。她做了很多手术，然后去世了。她一直希望把一半财产留给八个孩子，而她去世的那年恰好是美国税法中唯一没有遗产税的一年。征税的方式有古怪。她就是在那一年去世的。当时，查理的净资产约为 20 亿左右。这件事发生在 2010 年。当时，他以伯克希尔股票的形式将大约 1.25 亿美元传给了他的每个孩子，这些股票现在可能价值 4 亿美元左右。从慈善的角度来看，孩子们做了很多了不起的事情。他们的成就令人印象深刻。他们做的事情彼此大相径庭。另一半，他曾经告诉我，他只是专注于把钱捐出去。他做了很多不同的捐赠。

I believe when he passed away, it may have been maybe a couple of billion. I do not know what he intended to do with that. I do not think he was planning for more to go to the kids. He must have planned something out, but I am not sure about that.

我相信他去世时，这笔钱可能有几十亿。我不知道他打算用这笔钱做什么。我不认为他打算把更多的钱留给孩子们。他一定计划了什么，但我不确定。

Robert: Anything else you want to share before we go, Mohnish?

罗伯特：在我们走之前，你还有什么要分享的吗，莫尼什？

Mohnish: I always enjoy speaking to YPO and of course being able to speak about Charlie was wonderful. I miss him terribly. I have been reflecting. We had a very unlikely 15-year friendship, and I never expected that. I always remember I would walk into Charlie's house and he would be working on some architectural plans. He would see me and there would be a twinkle in his eyes. He would be very happy and excited to see me. We always had a great time together. One of the things I have always felt is that I had a lot of faith in Charlie's judgment. He had a very strong, positive opinion of me. Any time I get into self-doubt, I remember that Charlie thought well of me. Life is okay. Everything is okay. I always fall back to that. I miss him a lot, and I am very grateful that my life was able to cross with such a remarkable person. I will never see someone like that again. They broke the mold after they made Charlie, so we are not going to see another Charlie Munger again. But he left us a great body of work, and it is wonderful to be able to look at that.

Mohnish：我一直都很喜欢在 YPO 上发言，当然，能够谈及查理也是一件美妙的事情。我非常想念他。我一直在反思。我们之间的友谊长达15年，这是我始料未及的。我一直记得，我走进查理的家时，他正在设计一些建筑图纸。他看到我，眼睛里闪烁着光芒。见到我，他会非常高兴和激动。我们在一起总是很开心。我一直觉得，我非常相信查理的判断力。他对我的评价非常坚定、积极。每当我自我怀疑时，我就会想起查理对我的评价。生活没问题。一切都很好。我总是这样想。我非常想念他，也非常感谢我的生命能与这样一位杰出的人交汇。我再也见不到这样的人了。在造就查理之后，他们打破了模式，所以我们不会再看到另一个查理-芒格了。但他给我们留下了大量的作品，能看到这些作品真是太好了。

Robert: Mohnish, thank you for taking the time. You are just an amazing disciple of both Charlie and Warren. I enjoyed following you on your podcast and social media. Thank you for being so active, and we hope to have a future connection and discussion with you at other events.

罗伯特：莫尼什，谢谢你抽出时间。你是查理和沃伦的杰出弟子。我很喜欢在播客和社交媒体上关注你。感谢你如此活跃，我们希望今后能在其他活动中与你进行交流和讨论。

Mohnish: Absolutely. I very much enjoyed Robert and thank you very much for all of you and all the best.

莫尼什当然。我非常喜欢罗伯特，非常感谢你们，祝你们一切顺利。

The contents of this transcript are for educational and entertainment purposes only, and do not purport to be, and are not intended to be financial, legal, accounting, tax, or investment advice. Investments or strategies that are discussed may not be suitable for you, do not take into account your particular investment objectives, financial situation, or needs, and are not intended to provide investment advice or recommendations appropriate for you. Before making any investment or trade, consider whether it is suitable for you and consider seeking advice from your own financial or investment adviser.

本记录稿的内容仅用于教育和娱乐目的，并非也无意成为财务、法律、会计、税务或投资建议。所讨论的投资或策略可能不适合您，没有考虑到您的特定投资目标、财务状况或需求，也无意提供适合您的投资意见或建议。在进行任何投资或交易之前，请考虑该投资或交易是否适合您，并考虑向您自己的财务或投资顾问寻求建议。