1730-09-10 Benjamin Franklin.PUBLIC MEN
The following is a dialogue between Socrates, the great Athenian philosopher, and one Glaucon, a private man, of mean abilities, but ambitious of being chosen a senator and of governing the republic; wherein Socrates in a pleasant manner convinces him of his incapacity for public affairs, by making him sensible of his ignorance of the interests of his country in their several branches, and entirely dissuades him from any attempt of that nature. There is also added, at the end, part of another dialogue the same Socrates had with one Charmidas, a worthy man, but too modest, wherein he endeavours to persuade him to put himself forward and undertake public business, as being very capable of it. The whole is taken from Xenophon's Memorable Things of Socrates, Book Third.
以下是苏格拉底这位伟大的雅典哲学家与格劳孔之间的对话，格劳孔是一个普通人，能力平庸，但雄心勃勃，渴望被选为参议员并治理共和国。在对话中，苏格拉底以一种愉快的方式说服他认识到自己在公共事务中的无能，提醒他对国家各方面利益的无知，并彻底劝阻他进行任何类似的尝试。最后，还附上了苏格拉底与查尔米达斯的另一段对话，查尔米达斯是一个值得尊敬的人，但过于谦虚，苏格拉底试图说服他站出来，承担公共事务，因为他非常有能力胜任。这一切来自色诺芬的《苏格拉底回忆录》第三卷。
"A certain man, whose name was Glaucon, the son of Ariston, had so fixed it in his mind to govern the republic, that he frequently presented himself before the people to discourse of affairs of state, though all the world laughed at him for it; nor was it in the power of his relations or friends to dissuade him from that design. But Socrates had a kindness for him, on account of Plato, his brother, and he only it was who made him change his resolution."
有一个名叫格劳孔的男子，阿里斯顿的儿子，他决心要治理共和国，以至于他经常出现在民众面前讨论国家事务，尽管所有人都嘲笑他；他的亲戚和朋友也无法劝阻他放弃这个计划。然而，由于他的兄弟柏拉图的关系，苏格拉底对他心生好感，只有苏格拉底让他改变了决心。
"He met him, and accosted him in so winning a manner, that he first obliged him to hearken to his discourse. He began with him thus: 'You have a mind, then, to govern the republic?'"
他遇见了格劳孔，并以一种极具亲和力的方式与他说话，以至于格劳孔首先愿意倾听他的讲话。他这样开头：“那么，你是想治理共和国吗？”
"'I have so,' answered Glaucon. 'You cannot,' replied Socrates, 'have a more noble design; for if you can accomplish it so as to become absolute, you will be able to serve your friends, you will raise your family, you will extend the bounds of your country, you will be known, not only in Athens, but through all Greece, and perhaps your renown will fly even to the barbarous nations, as did that of Themistocles. In short, wherever you come, you will have the respect and admiration of all the world.'"
“我确实如此，”格劳孔回答。“你没有更高贵的目标了，”苏格拉底说，“因为如果你能够实现这一目标，成为绝对统治者，你将能够为你的朋友们效力，你将抚养你的家人，你将扩展国家的疆界，你不仅会在雅典闻名，还会在整个希腊闻名，甚至可能你的声名会传到蛮族国家，就像提米斯托克勒斯一样。总之，无论你到哪里，都会赢得全世界的尊敬和钦佩。”
"These words soothed Glaucon, and won him to give ear to Socrates, who went on in this manner: 'But it is certain, that if you desire to be honoured, you must be useful to the state.'"
这些话安抚了格劳孔，使他愿意倾听苏格拉底的讲话，苏格拉底继续说道：“但可以肯定的是，如果你渴望获得荣誉，你必须对国家有所贡献。”
"'Certainly,' said Glaucon. 'And in the name of all the gods,' replied Socrates, 'tell me, what is the first service that you intend to render the state?'"
“当然，”格劳孔说。“那么，奉众神之名，”苏格拉底回答，“告诉我，你打算为国家做的第一件事是什么？”
"Glaucon was considering what to answer, when Socrates continued: 'If you design to make the fortune of one of your friends, you will endeavour to make him rich, and thus, perhaps, you will make it your business to enrich the republic?'"
格劳孔正在思考如何回答，苏格拉底接着说：“如果你打算让你的朋友发财，你会努力让他变得富有，那么，也许你会把自己当作责任，去使共和国富裕？”
"'I would,' answered Glaucon. Socrates replied, 'Would not the way to enrich the republic be to increase its revenue?'"
“我会的，”格劳孔回答。苏格拉底说：“那么，增加共和国的收入不就是使其富裕的方式吗？”
"'It is very likely it would,' answered Glaucon. 'Tell me, then, in what consists the revenue of the state, and to how much it may amount? I presume you have particularly studied this matter, to the end that, if anything should be lost on one hand, you might know where to make it good on another; and that, if a fund should fail on a sudden, you might immediately be able to settle another in its place?'"
“很可能是这样，”格劳孔回答。“那么，告诉我，国家的收入由什么组成，它可能是多少？我想你一定特别研究过这个问题，以便如果某一方面的收入有所损失，你能够知道在哪里弥补；如果某个资金突然失效，你是否能马上找出另一个替代方案？”
"'I protest,' answered Glaucon, 'I have never thought of this.' 'Tell me, at least, the expenses of the republic, for no doubt you intend to retrench the superfluous?'"
“我发誓，”格劳孔回答，“我从未考虑过这个问题。”“至少告诉我共和国的开支吧，毫无疑问，你打算削减多余的开支吧？”
"'I never thought of this either,' said Glaucon. 'You were best, then, to put off to another time your design of enriching the republic, which you can never be able to do while you are ignorant both of its expenses and revenue.'"
“我也从未考虑过这个，”格劳孔说。“那么，你最好推迟一下富国的计划，在你对国家的开支和收入一无所知的情况下，你永远无法做到这一点。”
"'There is another way to enrich a state,' said Glaucon, 'of which you take no notice; and that is, by the ruin [spoils] of its enemies.'"
“还有另一种使国家富裕的方式，”格劳孔说，“你没有提到，那就是通过敌人的毁灭[战利品]。”
"'You are in the right,' answered Socrates; 'but to this end it is necessary to be stronger than they, otherwise we shall run the hazard of losing what we have. He, therefore, who talks of undertaking a war, ought to know the strength on both sides, to the end that, if his party be the stronger, he may boldly advise for war, and that, if it be the weaker, he may dissuade the people from engaging themselves in so dangerous an enterprise.'"
“你说得对，”苏格拉底回答，“但是为此，必须比他们更强大，否则我们将面临失去已有的一切的风险。因此，谈论发动战争的人，应该知道双方的实力，以便如果自己方更强，他可以大胆提议发动战争；如果自己方较弱，则应劝阻人民不要卷入如此危险的事业。”
"'All this is true.' 'Tell me, then,' continued Socrates, 'how strong our forces are by sea and land, and how strong are our enemies.'"
“这一切都对。”“那么告诉我，”苏格拉底接着问，“我们海陆上的兵力有多强，我们的敌人有多强？”
"'Indeed,' said Glaucon, 'I cannot tell you on a sudden.'"
“确实，”格劳孔说，“我一下子无法告诉你。”
"'If you have a list of them in writing, pray show it me; I should be glad to hear it read.'"
“如果你有相关的书面清单，请给我看，我很愿意听你念出来。”
"'I have it not yet.'"
“我还没有。”
"'I see, then,' said Socrates, 'that we shall not engage in war so soon; for the greatness of the undertaking will hinder you from maturely weighing all the consequences of it in the beginning of your government.'"
“那么我明白了，”苏格拉底说，“我们不会很快开始战争；因为这项伟大的事业将阻碍你在治理初期仔细权衡其所有后果。”
"But,' continued he, 'you have thought of the defence of the country; you know what garrisons are necessary, and what are not; you know what number of troops is sufficient in one, and not sufficient in another; you will cause the necessary garrisons to be re-enforced, and disband those that are useless?'"
“不过，”他继续说道，“你考虑过国家的防卫吗？你知道哪些守军是必要的，哪些是不必要的；你知道某些地方需要多少兵力，另一些地方需要多少才合适；你将加强必要的守军，解散那些无用的兵力？”
"'I should be of opinion,' said Glaucon, 'to leave none of them on foot, because they ruin a country on pretence of defending it.'"
“我认为，”格劳孔说，“不应该留下任何守军，因为他们以保卫国家为名，实际上是在毁掉国家。”
"'But,' Socrates objected, 'if all the garrisons were taken away, there would be nothing to hinder the first comer from carrying off what he pleased; but how come you to know that the garrisons behave themselves so ill? Have you been upon the place? Have you seen them?'"
“但是，”苏格拉底反驳道，“如果所有守军都撤走了，任何人都可以肆意抢夺你们的财富；但你怎么知道守军的行为如此不当呢？你去过那个地方吗？你亲眼见过他们吗？”
"'Not at all; but I suspect it to be so.'"
“完全没有；但我怀疑情况是这样的。”
"'When, therefore, we are certain of it,' said Socrates, 'and can speak upon better grounds than simple conjectures, we will propose this advice to the senate.'"
“因此，”苏格拉底说，“当我们确信这一点，并能基于比单纯猜测更好的依据发言时，我们将向参议院提出这个建议。”
"'It may be well to do so,' said Glaucon. 'It comes into my mind, too,' continued Socrates, 'that you have never been at the mines of silver, to examine why they bring not in so much now as they did formerly.'"
“这样做可能是对的，”格劳孔说。“我也想到了，”苏格拉底继续说道，“你从未去过银矿，研究为什么它们现在的产量不如以前了。”
"'You say true; I have never been there.'"
“你说得对；我从未去过那里。”
"'Indeed, they say the place is very unhealthy, and that may excuse you.'"
“确实，他们说那个地方非常不健康，这可以作为你未曾去的借口。”
"'You rally me now,' said Glaucon. Socrates added, 'But I believe you have at least observed how much corn our land produces, how long it will serve to supply our city, and how much more we shall want for the whole year; to the end you may not be surprised with a scarcity of bread, but may give timely orders for the necessary provisions.'"
“你现在是在取笑我，”格劳孔说。苏格拉底接着说：“但我相信你至少观察过我们的土地产多少粮食，能供给我们的城市多久，全年还需要多少；这样你就不会因面包短缺而惊慌失措，而是能够及时安排必要的储备。”
"'There is a deal to do,' said Glaucon, 'if we must take care of all these things.'"
“如果我们必须照顾这些事情，确实有很多事要做，”格劳孔说。
"'There is so,' replied Socrates; 'and it is even impossible to manage our own families well, unless we know all that is wanting, and take care to provide it. As you see, therefore, that our city is composed of above ten thousand families, and it being a difficult task to watch over them all at once, why did you not first try to retrieve your uncle's affairs, which are running to decay? and, after having given that proof of your industry, you might have taken a greater trust upon you. But now, when you find yourself incapable of aiding a private man, how can you think of behaving yourself so as to be useful to a whole people? Ought a man, who has not strength enought to carry a hundred pound weight, to undertake to carry a heavier burden?'"
“确实如此，”苏格拉底回答，“而且即使是管理好我们自己的家庭，也不可能不清楚所有需求并采取措施来满足它们。所以你看，我们的城市有超过一万户人家，要同时照看这么多家庭是件很困难的事。那么，为什么你不首先试着去处理你叔叔家族的事务呢？这些事务正在衰败，经过这个努力的证明，你或许能担负更大的责任。但现在，当你发现自己无法帮助一个普通人时，你怎么能想到管理好整个民族呢？一个连一百磅重的东西都搬不动的人，怎能承担更重的负担呢？”
"'I would have done good service to my uncle,' said Glaucon, 'if he would have taken my advice.'"
“如果我叔叔听从我的建议，我本来能为他提供很好的帮助，”格劳孔说。
"'How,' replied Socrates, 'have you not hitherto been able to govern the mind of your uncle, and do you now believe yourself able to govern the minds of all the Athenians, and his among the rest? Take heed, my dear Glaucon, take heed lest too great a desire of power should render you despised; consider how dangerous it is to speak and entertain ourselves concerning things we do not understand; what a figure do those forward and rash people make in the world who do so; and judge yourself whether they acquire more esteem than blame, whether they are more admired than contemned. Think, on the contrary, with how much more honour a man is regarded who understands perfectly what he says and what he does, and then you will confess that renown and applause have always been the recompense of true merit, and shame the reward of ignorance and temerity. If, therefore, you would be honoured, endeavour to be a man of true merit; and if you enter upon the government of the republic with a mind more sagacious than usual, I shall not wonder if you succeed in all your designs.'"
“怎么，”苏格拉底回答，“你至今还未能管理你叔叔的心思，现在却认为自己能管理所有雅典人的心思，现在就连你叔叔的心思也无法管理，你怎么能认为自己能管理所有雅典人的心思呢？亲爱的格劳孔，慎重啊，慎重啊！过于渴望权力会使你被人轻视；想想看，谈论和思考我们不理解的事情是多么危险，那些轻率而鲁莽的人在世界上常常留下怎样的形象；你自己判断，他们是否获得了更多的尊敬而非责备，是否比其他人更受钦佩而非鄙视。相反，想想看，那些完全理解自己所说和所做的人的荣誉有多高，然后你会承认，真正的功绩总是获得声望和掌声，而无知和轻率则是耻辱的报应。因此，如果你想获得荣誉，就要努力成为一个真正有价值的人；如果你以比常人更睿智的心态来治理共和国，我相信你一定会在所有的计划中成功。”
Thus Socrates put a stop to the disorderly ambition of this man; but, on an occasion quite contrary, he in the following manner exhorted Charmidas to take an employment.
就这样，苏格拉底制止了这个人无序的野心；但在完全相反的情况下，他以以下方式劝告查尔米达斯接受职务。
"He was a man of sense, and more deserving than most others in the same post; but, as he was of a modest disposition, he constantly declined, and made great difficulties of engaging himself in public business. Socrates therefore addressed himself to him in this manner: 'If you knew any man that could gain the prizes in the public games, and by that means render himself illustrious, and acquire glory to his country, what would you say of him if he refused to offer himself to the combat?'"
他是一个明理的人，比许多担任同样职务的人更值得任用；但由于他性格谦逊，他总是拒绝，并且对于参与公共事务充满困难。因此，苏格拉底以这样的方式对他说：“如果你知道有一个人能在公共比赛中获胜，从而使自己声名显赫，为国家赢得荣耀，如果他拒绝参战，你会怎么看他？”
"'I would say,' answered Charmidas, 'that he was a mean-spirited, effeminate fellow.'"
“我会说，”查尔米达斯回答，“他是个懦弱、柔弱的人。”
"'And if a man were capable of governing a republic, of increasing its power by his advice, and of raising himself by this means to a high degree of honour, would you not brand him likewise with meanness of soul if he would not present himself to be employed?'"
“如果一个人有能力治理共和国，通过他的建议增强国家的力量，并通过此手段让自己升至更高的荣誉，你是否也会认为他软弱无能，如果他不愿意主动承担职务？”
"'Perhaps I might,' said Charmidas; 'but why do you ask me this question?' Socrates replied, 'Because you are capable of managing the affairs of the republic, and nevertheless you avoid doing so, though, in quality of a citizen, you are obliged to take care of the commonwealth. Be no longer, then, thus negligent in this matter; consider your abilities and your duty with more attention, and let not slip the occasions of serving the republic, and of rendering it, if possible, more flourishing than it is. This will be a blessing whose influence will descend not only on the other citizens, but on your best friends and yourself.'"
“也许我会，”查尔米达斯说，“但你为什么问我这个问题？”苏格拉底回答，“因为你有能力管理共和国的事务，然而你却避免这样做，尽管作为一个公民，你有责任照顾国家的事务。那么，不要再这样忽视这个问题；更加重视你自己的能力和责任，不要错过服务共和国的机会，尽可能地使它更加繁荣。这将是一种福祉，它的影响不仅会传递给其他公民，还会影响你最亲近的朋友和你自己。”
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