2024-08-14 Tencent Holdings Limited (TCEHY) Q2 2024 Earnings Call Transcript
Tencent Holdings Limited (OTCPK:TCEHY) Q2 2024 Earnings Conference Call August 14, 2024 8:00 AM ET
腾讯控股有限公司 (OTCPK:TCEHY) 2024 年第二季度财报电话会议 2024 年 8 月 14 日 上午 8:00 东部时间
Company Participants 公司参与者
Wendy Huang - Investor Relations
黄文迪 - 投资者关系
Pony Ma - Chairman and Chief Executive Officer
马化腾 - 董事长兼首席执行官
Martin Lau - President
马丁·刘 - 总裁
James Mitchell - Chief Strategy Officer
詹姆斯·米切尔 - 首席战略官
John Lo - Chief Financial Officer
约翰·洛 - 首席财务官
Conference Call Participants
会议电话参与者
Alicia Yap - Citigroup 艾莉西亚·叶 - 花旗集团
Kenneth Fong - UBS
Kenneth Fong - 瑞银
Ronald Keung - Goldman Sachs
罗纳德·强 - 高盛
Alex Yao - JP Morgan
亚历克斯·姚 - 摩根大通
Charlene Liu - HSBC
刘查琳 - 汇丰银行
William Packer - BNP Paribas
威廉·帕克 - 法国巴黎银行
Thomas Chong - Jefferies
托马斯·钟 - 杰富瑞
Gary Yu - Morgan Stanley
加里·余 - 摩根士丹利
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Good day and good evening. Thank you for standing by. Welcome to Tencent Holdings Limited 2024 Second Quarter Results Announcement Webinar. This is Wendy Huang from the Tencent IR team.
大家好，晚上好。感谢您的耐心等待。欢迎参加腾讯控股有限公司 2024 年第二季度业绩公告网络研讨会。我是来自腾讯投资者关系团队的 Wendy Huang。
At this time, all participants are in a listen-only mode. After management’s presentation, there will be a question-and-answer session. For participants who dial in by phone, if you wish to ask a question, please press five on your telephone to raise your hand. If you are accessing from the Tencent Meeting or VooV Meeting application, please click the Raise Hand button at the bottom left, and please be advised that today’s webinar is being recorded.
此时，所有参与者处于仅听模式。在管理层的演示之后，将进行问答环节。对于通过电话拨入的参与者，如果您希望提问，请按电话上的五号键举手。如果您是通过腾讯会议或 VooV 会议应用程序访问，请点击左下角的举手按钮，并请注意，今天的网络研讨会正在录制中。
Before we start the presentation, we would like to remind you that this includes forward-looking statements, which are underlined by a number of risks and uncertainties and may not be realized in the future for various reasons. Information about general market conditions is coming from a variety of sources outside of Tencent.
在我们开始演示之前，我们想提醒您，这包括前瞻性声明，这些声明受到多种风险和不确定性的影响，可能由于各种原因在未来无法实现。有关一般市场状况的信息来自腾讯以外的多种来源。
This presentation also contains some unaudited non-IFRS financial measures that should be considered in addition to, but not as a substitute for, measures of the Group’s financial performance prepared in accordance with IFRS. For a detailed discussion of risk factors and non-IFRS measures, please refer to our disclosure documents on the IR section of our website.
本演示文稿还包含一些未经审计的非国际财务报告准则（IFRS）财务指标，这些指标应与根据 IFRS 编制的集团财务业绩指标一起考虑，而不是替代它们。有关风险因素和非 IFRS 指标的详细讨论，请参阅我们网站投资者关系部分的披露文件。
Let me now introduce the management team on the webinar tonight. Our Chairman and CEO, Pony Ma will kick off with a short overview. President Martin Lau and Chief Strategy Officer James Mitchell will provide a business review. Chief Financial Officer John Lo will conclude with a financial discussion before we open the floor for questions.
现在让我介绍一下今晚网络研讨会的管理团队。我们的董事长兼首席执行官马化腾将首先进行简要概述。总裁刘炽平和首席战略官詹姆斯·米切尔将提供业务回顾。首席财务官罗杰将以财务讨论结束，然后我们将开放提问环节。
I will now pass it to Pony.
我现在将把它交给 Pony。
Pony Ma 马化腾
Thank you, Wendy. Good evening. Thank you everyone for joining us. Our second quarter 2024 results demonstrated the strengths of our platform plus content strategy. Our domestic games revenue resumed growth and our international game revenue accelerated growth, due to increased user engagement at several of our evergreen titles, and the successful launch of certain new games. Tencent Video achieved notable audience and subscriber growth with drama series developed from China Literature IP and produced internally.
谢谢你，Wendy。晚上好。感谢大家加入我们。我们2024年第二季度的业绩展示了我们平台加内容战略的优势。我们的国内游戏收入恢复了增长，而我们的国际游戏收入加速了增长，这得益于我们几款常青游戏的用户参与度增加，以及某些新游戏的成功推出。腾讯视频通过中国文学IP开发的剧集和内部制作的剧集实现了显著的观众和订阅用户增长。
Looking forward, we continue to invest in our platforms and technologies, including AI, enabling us to create new business value and better serve user needs. Looking at our financial numbers for the quarter. Total revenue was RMB161 billion, up 8% year-on-year and 1% quarter-on-quarter. Gross profit was RMB86 billion, up 21% year-on-year and 2% quarter-on-quarter. Non-IFRS operating profit was RMB58 billion, up 27% year-on-year or flat quarter-on-quarter.
展望未来，我们将继续投资于我们的平台和技术，包括人工智能，使我们能够创造新的商业价值，更好地满足用户需求。查看我们本季度的财务数据。总收入为 1610 亿元人民币，同比增长 8%，环比增长 1%。毛利润为 860 亿元人民币，同比增长 21%，环比增长 2%。非国际财务报告准则的营业利润为 580 亿元人民币，同比增长 27%，环比持平。
Turning to our key services. For communications and social networks, combined MAU of Weixin and WeChat grew year-on-year and quarter-and-quarter to 1.37 billion. For digital content, Tencent Video led the industry in terms of audience and subscriptions. For games, our proactive adjustments to several of our leading games earlier in the year are yielding positive results, with healthy user trends for our evergreen games and substantial popularity for several new games.
转向我们的关键服务。在通讯和社交网络方面，微信和 WeChat 的月活跃用户总数同比和环比增长至 13.7 亿。在数字内容方面，腾讯视频在观众和订阅量方面领先行业。在游戏方面，我们对年初几款主力游戏的积极调整正在产生积极效果，常青游戏的用户趋势健康，几款新游戏也获得了相当的受欢迎程度。
For cloud enterprise SaaS, WeCom and Tencent Meeting increased their penetration in major industry verticals and upsold more paid functionalities.
对于云企业 SaaS，WeCom 和腾讯会议在主要行业垂直领域的渗透率提高，并且销售了更多的付费功能。
I will now hand over to Martin Lau for business review.
我现在将把业务审查的工作交给马丁·刘。
Martin Lau 马丁·刘
Thank you Pony. Good evening and good morning to everybody. For the second quarter of 2024, our total revenue was up 8% year-on-year. VAS represented 49% of our total revenue. Within which, social networks subsegment was 19%, domestic games subsegment was 21% and international games was 9%. Online advertising was 19% of total revenue. And FinTech and business services was 31% of total revenue.
谢谢 Pony。大家晚上好，早上好。2024 年第二季度，我们的总收入同比增长了 8%。增值服务占我们总收入的 49%。其中，社交网络子细分市场占 19%，国内游戏子细分市场占 21%，国际游戏占 9%。在线广告占总收入的 19%。金融科技和商业服务占总收入的 31%。
Turning to gross profit. Our overall gross profit growth was 21% year-on-year in the second quarter, driven by growth in high margin revenue streams, such as domestic games revenues, Video Accounts advertising revenues, Mini Games platform service fees, and e-commerce technology service fees within Video Accounts, as well as cost-savings initiatives.
转向毛利润。我们的整体毛利润在第二季度同比增长了 21%，这得益于高利润率收入来源的增长，例如国内游戏收入、视频账号广告收入、迷你游戏平台服务费以及视频账号内的电子商务技术服务费，以及节省成本的举措。
科技企业的优势，停下来就能大幅度增长利润。
By segment, VAS gross profit increased 12% year-on-year to RMB45 billion, representing 52% of our total gross profit. Online advertising gross profit increased 36% year-on-year to RMB17 billion, contributing 19% of total gross profit. And FinTech and business services gross profit increased 29% year-on-year to RMB24 billion, contributing 28% of total gross profit.
按细分，增值服务（VAS）毛利润同比增长 12%，达到 450 亿元人民币，占我们总毛利润的 52%。在线广告毛利润同比增长 36%，达到 170 亿元人民币，贡献了总毛利润的 19%。金融科技和商业服务毛利润同比增长 29%，达到 240 亿元人民币，贡献了总毛利润的 28%。
Moving into business by segment, for value added services, segment revenue was RMB79 billion, up 6% year-on-year. Social network revenue returned to positive growth, up 2% year-on-year, driven by increased revenue for music and video subscriptions, Mini Games platform service fees, and app-based games item sales, which was partially offset by decreased revenue from music and games-related live streaming services.
按业务细分，增值服务的收入为 790 亿元人民币，同比增长 6%。社交网络收入恢复正增长，同比增长 2%，主要受音乐和视频订阅收入、迷你游戏平台服务费以及基于应用的游戏道具销售增加的推动，部分被音乐和游戏相关的直播服务收入下降所抵消。
主要业务增长有限，毛利润大幅度增加。
Long-form video subscription revenue increased 12% year-on-year, as average daily video subscriptions increased 13% year-on-year to 117 million. Consumers are increasingly seeking out high quality IP and high production value in drama series. Our web novels, comics, and games platforms nurture high quality IPs, while our studios, including New Classics Media, create high production value video content.
长视频订阅收入同比增长 12%，日均视频订阅量同比增长 13%，达到 1.17 亿。消费者越来越追求高质量的知识产权和高制作价值的剧集。我们的网络小说、漫画和游戏平台培育高质量的知识产权，而我们的工作室，包括新经典传媒，制作高制作价值的视频内容。
During the first-half of 2024, out of the top three most watched drama series on China's online video platforms, the first and second were produced by New Classics Media and broadcast by Tencent Video, and all three were based on China Literature web novel IPs.
在 2024 年上半年，中国在线视频平台上观看次数最多的三部电视剧中，前两部由新经典传媒制作并由腾讯视频播出，三部剧均基于中国文学网络小说 IP。
Music subscription revenue increased 29% year-on-year, supported by growth in subscriptions in ARPU. TME strengthened cooperation with labels and artists, releasing original soundtracks for Tencent Video popular drama series, and provided live music experiences through offline events and concert tours.
音乐订阅收入同比增长 29%，得益于 ARPU 的订阅增长。TME 加强了与唱片公司和艺术家的合作，为腾讯视频热门剧集发布原创音乐原声带，并通过线下活动和音乐会巡演提供现场音乐体验。
Domestic games revenue resumed growth, up by 9% year-on-year to RMB35 billion, mainly driven by Valorant and new title DnF Mobile. Total gross receipts of domestic games grew faster than revenue in the second quarter.
国内游戏收入恢复增长，同比增长 9%，达到 350 亿元人民币，主要受到《Valorant》和新游戏《地下城与勇士手游》的推动。第二季度国内游戏的总收入增长速度快于收入。
International games revenue increased by 9% year-on-year in both reported and constant currency terms, to RMB14 billion, benefiting from the robust performance of PUBG Mobile, as well as contributions from Supercell games. Total gross receipts of international games grew substantially faster than revenue in the second quarter.
国际游戏收入同比增长 9%，以报告货币和固定货币计算，达到 140 亿元人民币，受益于《绝地求生：刺激战场》的强劲表现，以及 Supercell 游戏的贡献。国际游戏的总收入在第二季度的增长速度显著快于收入增长。
For communications and social network, we enhanced functionalities and enriched content across our platforms, including Video Accounts, Mini Programs, and Tencent Channels. For Video Accounts, the user time spent increased significantly year-on-year in the second quarter, benefiting from enhanced algorithms and more local content. Our thriving content ecosystem enabled creators to reach a wider audience and generate increased revenue. The number of creators that generated closed loop revenue from their Video Accounts more than tripled year-on-year, showing a much more vibrant content ecosystem.
为了通信和社交网络，我们增强了功能并丰富了我们平台上的内容，包括视频账号、小程序和腾讯频道。在视频账号方面，用户在第二季度的使用时间同比显著增加，得益于算法的提升和更多本地内容。我们蓬勃发展的内容生态系统使创作者能够接触更广泛的受众并产生更多收入。通过视频账号产生闭环收入的创作者数量同比增长超过三倍，显示出一个更加活跃的内容生态系统。
To facilitate e-commerce activity, we are enhancing transaction capabilities in a systematic way to deliver seamless shopping experience to users and drive sales for merchants.
为了促进电子商务活动，我们正在以系统化的方式增强交易能力，以为用户提供无缝的购物体验，并推动商家的销售。
Mini Programs have become an increasingly powerful platform for users to connect with merchants and content providers, offline and online. Total user time spent on Mini Programs increased over 20% year-on-year in the second quarter. GMV facilitated by Mini Programs grew double-digit percentage year-on-year.
小程序已成为用户与商家和内容提供者在线下和线上连接的一个越来越强大的平台。第二季度，用户在小程序上花费的总时间同比增长超过 20%。小程序促进的 GMV 同比增长了两位数百分比。
For Mini Games, total gross receipts increased over 30% year-on-year, and as a testimony to the diversity of the games, more than 140 mini games each achieved total gross receipts of over RMB10 million during the quarter.
对于迷你游戏，总收入同比增长超过 30%，作为游戏多样性的证明，超过 140 款迷你游戏在本季度的总收入均超过 1000 万元人民币。
Lastly, Tencent Channels served as a community-based platform in which moderators can manage and present content and events via customizable tools, while users can interact via text, image, and live streaming. We recently upgraded and rebranded Tencent Channels, previously known as QQ Channels, and now users can join Channels from Weixin and from game apps, in addition to QQ. Tencent Channels have gained notable popularity among game players and university students, who are early adopters and promoters of Channels’ advanced functionalities.
最后，腾讯频道作为一个基于社区的平台，版主可以通过可定制的工具管理和展示内容和活动，而用户可以通过文本、图片和直播进行互动。我们最近升级并重新品牌化了腾讯频道，之前称为 QQ 频道，现在用户可以通过微信和游戏应用加入频道，除了 QQ 之外。腾讯频道在游戏玩家和大学生中获得了显著的受欢迎程度，他们是频道高级功能的早期采用者和推广者。
With that, I'll pass to James.
接下来，我将把话传给詹姆斯。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
Thank you, Martin. Moving on to domestic games, Peacekeeper Elite grew its gross receipts by a double-digit percentage year-on-year in the second quarter, with popular Egyptian-themed and anime-themed outfits. We introduced Metro Royale, an extraction shooter game mode, that's already proven attractive in PUBG Mobile, and which resulted in Peacekeeper Elite's DAU resuming year-on-year growth in July.
谢谢你，马丁。接下来谈谈国内游戏，《和平精英》在第二季度的总收入同比增长了两位数百分比，推出了受欢迎的埃及主题和动漫主题服装。我们推出了《地铁皇家》，这是一种提取射击游戏模式，在《PUBG Mobile》中已经证明了其吸引力，这使得《和平精英》的日活跃用户在七月份恢复了同比增长。
Honor of Kings also increased its gross receipts year-on-year in the second quarter, benefiting from adjustments we made to spread out the timing of high-value virtual item sales throughout the year, as well as from enhanced content design.
王者荣耀在第二季度的总收入同比也有所增加，这得益于我们对高价值虚拟物品销售时间进行调整，使其分散在全年，以及内容设计的增强。
Naruto Mobile achieved a new milestone of 10 million average daily active users in May, as marketing activities have boosted its new player acquisition, while enriched themed content has reengaged its existing user base.
《火影忍者手游》在 5 月份达到了每日平均活跃用户 1000 万的新里程碑，营销活动促进了新玩家的获取，而丰富的主题内容重新吸引了现有用户群。
Among new releases, DNF Mobile has emerged as one of the most successful mobile games in China. The game reactivated millions of DNF IP fans and more importantly for long-term success, we're seeing high user retention rates due to proven gameplay, abundant content, and active local publishing, which together position the game to become our next evergreen major hit.
在新发布的游戏中，DNF Mobile 已成为中国最成功的手机游戏之一。该游戏重新激活了数百万 DNF IP 粉丝，更重要的是，出于长期成功的考虑，我们看到由于经过验证的游戏玩法、丰富的内容和活跃的本地发行，用户留存率很高，这些因素共同使得该游戏有望成为我们下一个常青的重大热门。
Need for Speed Mobile, launched in July, is attracting millions of DAUs by providing a range of driving-centric activities within an open-world city experience.
《极品飞车：移动版》于七月上线，通过在开放世界城市体验中提供一系列以驾驶为中心的活动，吸引了数百万日活跃用户。
Among our international games, PUBG Mobile's DAU and gross receipts achieved double-digit percentage growth year-on-year, driven by the new Mecha Fusion mode, the Golden Moon event, and a lion-themed top-tier outfit.
在我们的国际游戏中，PUBG Mobile 的日活跃用户和总收入实现了同比两位数百分比增长，这得益于新的机械融合模式、金月活动和狮子主题的顶级服装。
Brawl Stars gross receipts grew more than ten-folds year-on-year. Average DAU achieved a historical high and ranked Brawl as the third highest mobile game across the entire industry by DAU in international markets in the second quarter. These achievements flowed from frequent content updates, such as an IP collaboration with Godzilla, and social features, such as the thumbs up for Brawl event.
《荒野乱斗》的总收入同比增长超过十倍。平均日活跃用户数达到了历史新高，并在第二季度国际市场中排名为第三大移动游戏。这些成就源于频繁的内容更新，例如与哥斯拉的知识产权合作，以及社交功能，例如《荒野乱斗》活动的点赞功能。
VALORANT MAU grew year-on-year, benefiting from high quality content updates, such as new agent Clove and new map Abyss, the first VALORANT map with no outer boundaries. Two international esports events, Masters Madrid and Masters Shanghai, expanded VALORANTs global IP influence.
VALORANT MAU 年同比增长，受益于高质量的内容更新，如新特工 Clove 和新地图 Abyss，这是第一张没有外部边界的 VALORANT 地图。两个国际电子竞技赛事，马德里大师赛和上海大师赛，扩大了 VALORANT 的全球知识产权影响力。
Squad Busters, a casual PVP/PVE action game with real-time strategy elements and Supercell character collection, launched on May 29. Squad Busters has established critical mass in the key North America and Western Europe regions, and Supercell will be adding new game modes and social features to the game to further expand its fan base worldwide.
Squad Busters 是一款结合了实时策略元素和 Supercell 角色收集的休闲 PVP/PVE 动作游戏，于 5 月 29 日上线。Squad Busters 在北美和西欧的关键地区已建立了重要的用户基础，Supercell 将为游戏添加新的游戏模式和社交功能，以进一步扩大其全球粉丝群。
For online advertising, revenue grew 19% year-on-year, driven by increased ad spend from most categories, particularly games, e-commerce, and education. The deceleration in consumption spending in China is a headwind to advertising eCPM pricing, and thus to our brand advertising and ad network trends. But we believe we'll continue improving our advertising market share, and our advertising business should benefit once consumer spending improves.
在线广告方面，收入同比增长 19%，主要受到大多数类别广告支出增加的推动，特别是游戏、电商和教育。中国消费支出的放缓对广告 eCPM 定价构成了阻力，因此对我们的品牌广告和广告网络趋势产生影响。但我们相信，我们将继续提升广告市场份额，一旦消费支出改善，我们的广告业务将受益。
For our ad tech, we upgraded our machine learning platform to analyze user interests over a longer time horizon of years rather than months, while processing signals more frequently. These changes enable us to gain deeper user insights and provide more relevant ad recommendations, thus boosting click-through rates and revenue.
为了我们的广告技术，我们升级了机器学习平台，以便在更长的时间范围内（以年而不是月）分析用户兴趣，同时更频繁地处理信号。这些变化使我们能够获得更深入的用户洞察，并提供更相关的广告推荐，从而提高点击率和收入。
By property, Video Accounts ad revenue increased over 80% year-on-year, fueled by rising short video engagement, as well as demand for live streaming promotions. Tencent Video ad revenue grew over 30% year-on-year, despite weak branded ad spend market-wide, as our popular self-commissioned drama series such as Joy of Life 2 and The Tale of Rose, attracted sponsorship ad spend.
根据数据显示，视频账户的广告收入同比增长超过 80%，这得益于短视频参与度的提升以及对直播推广的需求。尽管整体品牌广告支出疲软，腾讯视频的广告收入同比增长超过 30%，因为我们受欢迎的自制剧集如《庆余年 2》和《玫瑰的故事》吸引了赞助广告支出。
However, our mobile ad network revenue dropped year-on-year, as certain internet services companies reduced their overall advertising spend.
然而，由于某些互联网服务公司减少了整体广告支出，我们的移动广告网络收入同比下降。
Looking at FinTech and business services, segment revenue was RMB50 billion, up 4% year on year. Our FinTech services revenue slowed to a low-single-digit year-on-year growth rate. The number of commercial payment transactions continued to increase at a healthy rate year-on-year, but the average value per payment transaction declined year-on-year, due to slow consumer spending, causing further moderation in our commercial payment revenue growth. But given the continuing growth in number of transactions, we believe that our market share is quite stable, and we therefore expect our commercial payment revenue to improve once consumer spending picks up.
在金融科技和商业服务方面，细分收入为 500 亿元人民币，同比增长 4%。我们的金融科技服务收入增速放缓至低个位数的同比增长率。商业支付交易数量继续以健康的速度同比增长，但由于消费者支出放缓，导致每笔支付交易的平均价值同比下降，从而进一步抑制了我们的商业支付收入增长。但考虑到交易数量的持续增长，我们相信我们的市场份额相当稳定，因此我们预计一旦消费者支出回升，我们的商业支付收入将会改善。
Our consumer loan services revenue decreased year-on-year as WeBank and Tencent proactively adopted more cautious credit extension policies in light of subdued consumption trends. Our wealth management revenue grew at a double-digit percentage year-on-year, due to increases in the number of users and in aggregate customer assets as consumers generally saved more and spent less.
我们的消费贷款服务收入同比下降，因为微众银行和腾讯在消费趋势低迷的情况下主动采取了更为谨慎的信贷扩展政策。我们的财富管理收入同比增长了两位数百分比，原因是用户数量和客户资产总额增加，因为消费者普遍储蓄增多、消费减少。
Turning to business services, revenue grew at a teens rate year-on-year in the second quarter, benefiting from higher cloud services revenue and increased technology service fees generated from rising Video Accounts e-commerce transaction volumes. Business services gross profit rose significantly year-on-year, due to the increased contribution of higher margin revenue streams, as well as improved efficiency.
转向商业服务，第二季度收入同比增长了十几个百分点，受益于云服务收入的增加和由于视频账户电子商务交易量上升而产生的技术服务费用的增加。商业服务的毛利润同比大幅上升，得益于高利润率收入来源的贡献增加以及效率的提高。
In WeCom, merchants are increasingly willing to pay for advanced communication functionalities such as customer service chat groups. And WeCom revenue accordingly increased significantly year-on-year. Tencent Meeting deepened its adoption and monetization, especially in the pharmaceutical, manufacturing and retail sectors.
在企业微信中，商家越来越愿意为高级沟通功能支付费用，例如客服聊天群。因此，企业微信的收入同比显著增长。腾讯会议在药品、制造和零售行业的采用和货币化加深。
We're generating increasing AI-related external revenue from customers utilizing our high-performance computing infrastructure such as GPUs and our model library services.We recently launched three AI-powered platform solutions for enterprises, Image Generation Engine and Video Generation Engine, which are particularly useful for advertisers creating ad content as well as knowledge engine which is particularly useful for finance, education and retail-related services deploying customer service chatbots.
我们正在从利用我们高性能计算基础设施（如 GPU）和我们的模型库服务的客户那里生成越来越多的与 AI 相关的外部收入。我们最近推出了三种面向企业的 AI 驱动平台解决方案，图像生成引擎和视频生成引擎，这些解决方案对于创建广告内容的广告商特别有用，以及知识引擎，这对于金融、教育和零售相关服务部署客户服务聊天机器人特别有用。
And now I'll pass to John for the financial review.
现在我将把时间交给约翰进行财务审查。
John Lo 约翰·洛
Thank you, James. Hello everyone. For the second quarter of 2024, total revenue was RMB161.1 billion, up 8% year-on-year. Gross profit was RMB85.9 billion, up 21% year-on-year. Operating profit was RMB50.7 billion, up 40% year-on-year.
谢谢你，詹姆斯。大家好。2024 年第二季度，总收入为 1611 亿元人民币，同比增长 8%。毛利润为 859 亿元人民币，同比增长 21%。营业利润为 507 亿元人民币，同比增长 40%。
Interest income was RMB3.9 billion, up 13% year-on-year, driven by growth in cash reserves. Finance costs were RMB3.1 billion, down 5% year-on-year due to a reduced debt level. Share of profit of associates and JV was RMB7.7 billion compared to profit of RMB1.2 billion in the same period last year.
利息收入为人民币 39 亿元，同比增长 13%，主要受现金储备增长的推动。财务成本为人民币 31 亿元，同比下降 5%，由于债务水平降低。联营公司和合资企业的利润份额为人民币 77 亿元，而去年同期的利润为人民币 12 亿元。
On a non-IFRS basis share of profit was RMB9.9 billion, up from profit of RMB3.9 billion last year, driven by improved performance at certain domestic associates and at certain overseas games studio associates.
在非国际财务报告准则基础上，联合营分占利润为 99 亿元人民币，较去年 39 亿元人民币的利润增长，主要得益于某些国内联营公司和某些海外游戏工作室联营公司的业绩改善。
Income tax expense declined by 9% year-on-year to RMB10.1 billion, primarily due to the high base in the same quarter last year resulting from an overseas subsidiarie’s deferred tax adjustment. Our domestic corporate income tax expense in the second quarter of 2024 increased year-on-year.
所得税费用同比下降 9%，至人民币 101 亿元，主要是由于去年同期海外子公司的递延税款调整导致的高基数。我们 2024 年第二季度的国内企业所得税费用同比增加。
On non-IFRS financial figures, operating profit was RMB58.4 billion, up 27% year-on-year. Net profit attributable to equity holders was RMB57.3 billion, up 53% year-on-year. The difference in year-on-year growth rates between operating profit and net profit was due to higher non-IFRS share of profit from associates and JV, which increased to RMB9.9 billion this quarter from RMB3.9 billion same quarter last year, as well as lower income tax due to previously mentioned high base impact.
在非国际财务报告准则（IFRS）财务数据中，营业利润为 584 亿元人民币，同比增长 27%。归属于股东的净利润为 573 亿元人民币，同比增长 53%。营业利润和净利润之间的同比增长率差异是由于来自联营公司和合资企业的非 IFRS 利润份额增加，本季度从去年同期的 39 亿元人民币增加至 99 亿元人民币，以及由于之前提到的高基数影响导致的较低所得税。
Diluted EPS was RMB6.014, up 55% year-on-year, outpacing non-IFRS net profit growth due to reduced share count from share buybacks. For the second quarter of 2024, our weighted average number of shares for calculating diluted EPS decreased by 1.9% year-on-year.
稀释每股收益为人民币 6.014 元，同比增长 55%，由于股份回购导致股份数量减少，超出了非国际财务报告准则净利润的增长。2024 年第二季度，我们用于计算稀释每股收益的加权平均股份数量同比减少了 1.9%。
Moving on to gross margin, overall gross margin was 53%, up 6 percentage points year-on-year. By segment, value-added services gross margin was 57%, up 3 percentage points year-on-year, due to improved margins in long-form video and games businesses, alongside our effective control of operating costs.
在毛利方面，整体毛利率为 53%，同比上升 6 个百分点。按细分市场来看，增值服务的毛利率为 57%，同比上升 3 个百分点，这得益于长视频和游戏业务毛利的改善，以及我们对运营成本的有效控制。
Online advertising gross margin increased to 56%, up 7 percentage points year-on-year, primarily driven by growth in high-margin video accounts advertising revenue and margin improvement in long-form video advertising.
在线广告毛利率提高至 56%，同比增长 7 个百分点，主要受高毛利视频账户广告收入增长和长视频广告毛利改善的推动。
FinTech and business services gross margin increased to 48%, up 9 percentage points year-on-year. This was driven by enhanced cost efficiency in our cloud business, higher contribution from high-margin wealth management services revenues and e-commerce technology service fees within Video Accounts and improved monetization of WeCom and other business services.
金融科技和商业服务的毛利率提高至 48%，同比增长 9 个百分点。这得益于我们云业务的成本效率提升、高毛利财富管理服务收入和视频账户内电子商务技术服务费用的贡献增加，以及 WeCom 和其他商业服务的货币化改善。
On operating expenses, selling and marketing expenses were RMB9.2 billion, up 10% year-on-year, driven by increased spending on promotion and advertising for new content releases. Selling and marketing expenses represented 6% of revenue, stable year-on-year. R&D expenses were RMB17.3 billion, up 8% year-on-year. G&A expenses excluding R&D were RMB10.2 billion, up 9% year-on-year, due to an increase in staff cost, including performance-based rewards.
在运营费用方面，销售和营销费用为 92 亿元人民币，同比增长 10%，主要由于新内容发布的推广和广告支出增加。销售和营销费用占收入的 6%，同比持平。研发费用为 173 亿元人民币，同比增长 8%。不包括研发的管理和行政费用为 102 亿元人民币，同比增长 9%，主要由于员工成本的增加，包括基于绩效的奖励。
At quarter end, we had approximately 106,000 employees, up about 1% both year-on-year and quarter-on-quarter.
在季度末，我们大约有 106,000 名员工，同比增长和环比均增长约 1%。
Non-IFRS operating margin was 36%, up 5 percentage points year-on-year, in line with gross margin expansion.
非国际财务报告准则的营业利润率为 36%，同比上升 5 个百分点，与毛利率扩张一致。
To conclude, I will highlight some key cash flow and balance sheet metrics. Operating CapEx was RMB7.2 billion, up 144% year-on-year driven by investments in GPU and CPU servers. On a quarter-on-quarter basis, operating CapEx was up 8%.
最后，我将强调一些关键的现金流和资产负债表指标。运营资本支出为 72 亿元人民币，同比增长 144%，主要受 GPU 和 CPU 服务器投资的推动。从季度环比来看，运营资本支出增长了8%。
占比不大，年利润15%以内。
Non-operating CapEx was RMB1.5 billion, up 53% year-on-year, driven by construction in progress. On a quarter-on-quarter basis, non-operating CapEx was down 80% from the high base in the prior quarter. As a result, total CapEx was RMB8.7 billion, up 121% year-on-year.
非经营性资本支出为人民币 15 亿元，同比增长 53%，主要受在建工程推动。按季度计算，非经营性资本支出较上季度的高基数下降了 80%。因此，总资本支出为人民币 87 亿元，同比增长 121%。
Free cash flow was RMB40.4 billion, up 35% year-on-year, primarily due to higher gross receipts from games. On a quarter-on-quarter basis, free cash flow was down 22%, due to a seasonal decline in games’ gross receipts post Chinese New Year holiday period.
自由现金流为 404 亿人民币，同比增长 35%，主要由于游戏的总收入增加。按季度计算，自由现金流下降了 22%，这是由于春节假期后游戏总收入的季节性下降。
Net cash position was RMB71.8 billion, down 22% quarter-on-quarter, primarily due to RMB34.2 billion share repurchase, and RMB28.9 billion dividend payment for year 2023 made during the quarter, both were largely funded by our free cash flow generation. Thank you.
净现金头寸为 718 亿元人民币，环比下降 22%，主要由于本季度进行的 342 亿元人民币股票回购和 289 亿元人民币的 2023 年股息支付，这两项主要由我们的自由现金流生成资金支持。谢谢。
Question-and-Answer Session
问答环节
A - Wendy Huang A - 黄文迪
Thank you John. We now open the floor for questions. [Operator Instructions] The first question comes from Alicia Yap from Citigroup.
谢谢你，约翰。我们现在开始提问环节。[操作员指示] 第一个问题来自花旗集团的阿莉西亚·亚普。
Alicia Yap 阿莉西亚·叶
Hi, thank you. Good evening management. Thanks for taking my questions and congrats on the solid result. First, questions can management elaborate a little bit your recent upgrade of the advertising technology platform? When management noted on the prepared remark, the upgraded technology will analyze the user interest over a longer time horizon, does that mean you are thinking back into the longer historical usage pattern to form more precise targeting attribute and to capture the potential change of the user habits over the years? Maybe can you share a little bit the details? And also how will these upgraded ad platform attract higher ad spend and maybe support the future ad revenue growth potential?
嗨，谢谢。晚上好，管理层。感谢您回答我的问题，并祝贺您取得的良好成绩。首先，管理层能否详细说明一下您最近对广告技术平台的升级？当管理层在准备的发言中提到，升级后的技术将分析用户兴趣的更长时间范围时，这是否意味着您正在回顾更长的历史使用模式，以形成更精确的定位属性，并捕捉用户习惯多年来的潜在变化？您能否分享一些细节？此外，这些升级后的广告平台将如何吸引更高的广告支出，并可能支持未来广告收入的增长潜力？
Second questions, given there's a recent supportive comments from the state council on the digital content, including gaming’s and others, will that change any of the company R&D resource deployment in the coming future in order to help boost small entertainment-related content consumptions opportunity? Thank you.
第二个问题，鉴于国务院最近对数字内容（包括游戏等）发表了支持性评论，这是否会改变公司在未来的研发资源配置，以帮助提升小型娱乐相关内容消费的机会？谢谢。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
Hi Alicia, thank you very much for your questions and I'll attempt to take the first one. So yes indeed, we are looking further back at actions over years rather than months. And the main benefit is to form a more comprehensive user interest graph. On the other hand, we're also looking with greater frequency at the most recent actions, and the main benefit of the most recent actions is to have a more precise and timely view on users current commercial intent. And so, looking further back and also looking more frequently at the most recent data are both beneficial, but for different reasons.
嗨，阿莉西亚，非常感谢你的问题，我将尝试回答第一个。确实，我们正在回顾多年来的行为，而不是几个月。主要的好处是形成一个更全面的用户兴趣图谱。另一方面，我们也在更频繁地查看最近的行为，最近行为的主要好处是能够更准确和及时地了解用户当前的商业意图。因此，回顾更久远的历史和更频繁地查看最新数据都是有益的，但原因不同。
好想法不是最重要的因素，敢为天下后的执行力可以走得更远。
And in terms of how the processes then attract more advertising spend, by understanding the user's interest graph better, by having more precision around their current commercial intent, we can improve the click-through rate. And today in China and worldwide, as you boost the click-through rate, then the majority of advertisers automatically allocate more advertising spend to you because you're delivering more clicks with the higher click through rate.
通过更好地理解用户的兴趣图谱，精确把握他们当前的商业意图，我们可以提高点击率。在中国和全球范围内，随着点击率的提升，大多数广告主会自动将更多的广告支出分配给你，因为你以更高的点击率带来了更多的点击。
Martin Lau 马丁·刘
In terms of your second question, I would say obviously the comments is actually supportive and very encouraging to us and our content business, especially the narrative around gaming, which is yet another approval and affirmation of the value of the industry, in addition to the continued issuance of banhao. And we felt this is definitely incrementally positive to the overall content industry.
关于你的第二个问题，我想说评论显然对我们和我们的内容业务是支持和鼓励的，特别是关于游戏的叙述，这不仅是对行业价值的又一次认可和肯定，还包括持续发布的版本号。我们觉得这对整体内容行业绝对是逐步积极的。
But having said that, we have already been making very long-term investments and strategic investments in the content industry. And the nature of the content industry, be it games or be it drama series, which originate from novels is that they are actually very long-term in nature. So if you look at the recent revival of our gaming business, as well as the success of our drama series, they really originate from investments that we made years ago.
但话虽如此，我们已经在内容行业进行了非常长期的投资和战略投资。内容行业的性质，无论是游戏还是源自小说的电视剧，实际上都是非常长期的。因此，如果你看看我们最近游戏业务的复苏，以及我们电视剧的成功，它们实际上源于我们多年前的投资。
参考乔布斯早年的评价：《I.H.5.Steve Jobs. Education》，这个行业还是有些缺陷的。
So from that perspective, rest assured that as a major player in the content industry, we have been making very strategic and long-term investments in the content industry, even when the industry was actually in turmoil. And that's the reason why we are now reaping the benefit of our investments. So we're not going to be sort of that short-term oriented, just reacting to one piece of news. But as an important player, we have been making very strategic investments all along the way, and we will continue to do that.
从这个角度来看，请放心，作为内容行业的主要参与者，我们一直在内容行业进行非常战略性和长期的投资，即使在行业实际上动荡不安的时候。这就是我们现在收获投资成果的原因。因此，我们不会短期导向，仅仅对一条新闻做出反应。作为一个重要的参与者，我们一直在沿途进行非常战略性的投资，并将继续这样做。
Alicia Yap 阿莉西亚·叶
Thank you. 谢谢。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thank you, Alicia. We will take the next question from Kenneth Fong from UBS.
谢谢你，Alicia。我们将接下来的问题交给来自瑞银的 Kenneth Fong。
Kenneth Fong 方凯宁
Hi, good evening, management. Thank you for taking my question. I have two questions. First is on live-streaming e-commerce, we noticed that there have been a meaningful slowdown in the GMV growth in the short video platform, live streaming e-commerce for the competitor in the recent quarter. Can management share with us the e-commerce strategy for our video accounts?
嗨，晚上好，管理层。感谢您回答我的问题。我有两个问题。第一个是关于直播电商，我们注意到在最近一个季度，竞争对手的短视频平台直播电商的 GMV 增长出现了显著放缓。管理层能否与我们分享一下我们视频账号的电商战略？
My second question is on the accounting side, specifically digging into two items. First of all the G&A, which is up 8% on a year-on-year basis, understand that the headcount is rather flattish on a year-on-year basis. So how much of this 8% increase is one-off in nature? And secondly, on tax, how should we model the effective tax rate over next two quarters as it has comes down a lot in the this quarter? Thank you.
我的第二个问题是关于会计方面的，具体涉及两个项目。首先是一般和行政费用（G&A），同比增长了 8%，而员工人数同比基本持平。那么，这 8%的增长中有多少是一次性的？其次，关于税务，我们应该如何对接下来两个季度的有效税率进行建模，因为本季度的有效税率大幅下降？谢谢。
Martin Lau 马丁·刘
Hi. I'll take the first question. In terms of the e-commerce activity in our Weixin ecosystem, so apart from the Mini Programs e-commerce, just on what you would call the live-streaming e-commerce, our growth in the quarter has still been very solid, very significant growth. So we're not seeing a slowdown in terms of GMV growth relative to the other short video platforms. And the main reason is because the size of our e-commerce GMV is actually very small compared to the size of theirs. So there's still a lot of headroom for us to grow.
嗨。我来回答第一个问题。关于我们微信生态系统中的电子商务活动，除了小程序电子商务之外，关于你所说的直播电子商务，我们在这一季度的增长依然非常稳健，增长幅度非常显著。因此，相较于其他短视频平台，我们并没有看到 GMV 增长的放缓。主要原因是我们的电子商务 GMV 规模实际上相对于他们的规模非常小。因此，我们仍然有很大的增长空间。
But having said that, we have recently repositioned our live-streaming e-commerce to make it more of a Weixin e-commerce system, in the sense that we are going to build that ecosystem, not just to base a point at the video accounts and live streaming channel. Instead, we are going to build our e-commerce ecosystem within Weixin, tying to the entire Weixin ecosystem. And that would obviously still draw a lot of strength from our official -- from our video accounts as well as our live-streaming channel.
但话虽如此，我们最近重新定位了我们的直播电商，使其更像一个微信电商系统，意味着我们将构建这个生态系统，而不仅仅是基于视频账号和直播频道。相反，我们将把我们的电商生态系统构建在微信内，连接整个微信生态系统。这显然仍将从我们的官方账号以及我们的直播频道中获得很多支持。
But at the same time, it will be connected to all the elements of the Weixin ecosystem, including official accounts, including Mini Programs, including enterprise Weixin, including all the social and group activities that are happening within Weixin. So that we would want to build an ecosystem in a very patient, but systematic way, so that it will be differentiated from just live-streaming e-commerce, and it will be much more valuable to the merchants and the users.
但与此同时，它将与微信生态系统的所有元素相连接，包括公众号，包括小程序，包括企业微信，包括在微信内发生的所有社交和群体活动。因此，我们希望以一种非常耐心但系统化的方式构建一个生态系统，使其与单纯的直播电商有所区别，并且对商家和用户更具价值。
朋友圈的持久性很好，不进入自己没有优势的领域，这跟苹果的做法是一样的。
And we also hope to solve the problem that you are seeing, right. There's a material slowdown in terms of GMV growth because live-streaming e-commerce can grow very fast. But then there is natural ceiling, but if we can build the e-commerce ecosystem within Weixin in the systematic way, leveraging all the sources of strength within Weixin, then hopefully we can actually build much bigger and meaningful and high ceiling e-commerce ecosystem.
我们也希望解决您所看到的问题，对吧。由于直播电商可以快速增长，因此 GMV 增长存在明显的放缓。但随后会有自然的上限，如果我们能够以系统化的方式在微信内构建电商生态系统，利用微信内所有的优势资源，那么我们希望实际上可以构建一个更大、更有意义且上限更高的电商生态系统。
And to some extent this is similar to the way we build our Mini Programs for quite a few years we built the ecosystem patiently. And it doesn't seem like it's generating a lot of revenue, but when it actually unleashes power, it generates a lot of user engagement, it becomes extremely valuable to merchants and content providers online and offline and it becomes a significant source of revenue in many different areas, including Mini Games as well. So that's the way we approach Weixin e-commerce.
在某种程度上，这与我们多年来构建小程序的方式相似，我们耐心地构建生态系统。虽然看起来并没有产生很多收入，但当它真正释放出力量时，会产生大量用户参与，这对线上和线下的商家和内容提供者来说变得极其有价值，并且在许多不同领域，包括小游戏，成为了重要的收入来源。这就是我们对待微信电商的方式。
John Lo 约翰·洛
Yes, in relation to G&A expenses, I will split into two parts to explain. R&D expenses increased by 8% year-on-year in quarter two, while G&A excluding R&D increased by about 8% to 9% also year-on-year in quarter two 2024. In whole of 2024, we expect R&D to increase by high-single-digit, while G&A excluding R&D also will increase by single-digit, as well on IFRS basis. So as a result, we expect that for the full-year of 2024 full-year, based on the latest estimate, it will increase by high-single-digit as well.
是的，关于一般和行政费用，我将分成两部分来解释。2024 年第二季度，研发费用同比增长了 8%，而不包括研发的 G&A 费用同比也增长了约 8%到 9%。在 2024 年全年，我们预计研发费用将增长高个位数，而不包括研发的 G&A 费用也将以个位数增长，基于国际财务报告准则。因此，我们预计 2024 年全年，根据最新估计，整体将增长高个位数。
扣成本还没有动到人。
In relation to the income tax, the non-IFRS, we should really look at the non-IFRS profits. You know, we can see that the decrease in income tax expense was due to deferred tax asset reversal in overseas subsidiary in Q2 last year, which formed a higher base for this year comparison. And it was of course offset by the increase by domestic income tax. The non-IFRS effective tax rate for last year full-year was 22% and we expect that the non-IFRS effective tax rate for 2024 will be within the range of 18% to 20%.
关于所得税，非国际财务报告准则（non-IFRS），我们应该真正关注非国际财务报告准则利润。你知道，我们可以看到，所得税费用的减少是由于去年第二季度海外子公司递延税资产的逆转，这为今年的比较形成了更高的基数。当然，这被国内所得税的增加所抵消。去年全年的非国际财务报告准则有效税率为 22%，我们预计 2024 年的非国际财务报告准则有效税率将在 18%到 20%之间。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thank you. 谢谢。
Kenneth Fong 方凯宁
Thank you very much.
非常感谢。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Next, the question from Miranda Zhang of BofA, can you hear us? Maybe we move to the next question.
接下来，来自美国银行的 Miranda Zhang 的问题，你能听到我们吗？也许我们可以进入下一个问题。
Miranda Zhang 张米兰达
Yes, I can hear you now.
是的，我现在能听到你。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Okay, thank you. Go ahead.
好的，谢谢。继续。
Miranda Zhang 张米兰达
Thank you. Thanks for the patience. So my questions are about the profit. My key question is about, so the new higher margin revenue streams have been driving a strong profit beat for the several quarters. Can management update us about matrix of these higher-margin streams? For example, what are the mix from them in revenue or gross profit? How fast are they growing? How much do they contribute to the gross profit growth rate?
谢谢你。感谢你的耐心。那么我的问题是关于利润的。我的关键问题是，新的高利润率收入来源在过去几个季度推动了强劲的利润超出预期。管理层能否更新一下这些高利润率收入来源的矩阵？例如，它们在收入或毛利润中的占比是多少？它们的增长速度有多快？它们对毛利润增长率的贡献有多少？
And then looking ahead, how do you think about the room of further upside to your gross margins of the key business segments? And then my follow-up question about the profit is that we have seen that the share of profit from associates and JVs increased significantly quarter-over-quarter, and also year-over-year, contributing to a significant portion of companies adjusted profit. So can management help us understand what are the drivers? And then as your investees are generally in a profit improving trend. Should we expect this line item to contribute to more profit upside and to continue to trend up going forward? Thank you.
然后展望未来，您如何看待关键业务部门毛利率进一步提升的空间？我的后续问题是，我们看到来自联营公司和合资企业的利润份额季度环比和同比显著增加，成为公司调整后利润的重要组成部分。管理层能否帮助我们理解这些驱动因素是什么？此外，由于您的投资对象通常处于利润改善的趋势中，我们是否应该期待这一项在未来为利润带来更多的提升，并继续上升？谢谢。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
Hi Miranda. Thank you for the questions. I'll take the first one in terms of the impact of the mix shift toward higher-margin revenue streams. So we don't quantify each one of them individually or the aggregate collectively. But one way of visualizing the trend is that in recent periods, gross profit has grown 2.x times as fast as our revenue. And that's been for two reasons. The primary reason has been the mix shift toward these higher-margin revenue streams that you talked about.
嗨，米兰达。感谢你的提问。我将首先回答关于向更高利润率收入流的组合转变的影响的问题。因此，我们并没有单独量化每一个或整体的总和。但一种可视化这一趋势的方法是，在最近的时期，毛利润的增长速度是我们收入的 2.x 倍。这主要有两个原因。主要原因是向你提到的这些更高利润率收入流的组合转变。
And then the secondary reason has been efficiency initiatives, cost management initiatives. And together those have resulted in the multiplier from revenue growth to 2.x times faster gross profit growth. Looking forward, then we do assume at some point some of the efficiency initiatives will have yielded the efficiencies that we sought to capture, and therefore that driver of gross profit growth exceeding multiplying revenue growth will decelerate.
其次，第二个原因是效率举措和成本管理举措。综合来看，这些因素使得收入增长的乘数达到了 2.x 倍的更快毛利增长。展望未来，我们假设在某个时刻，一些效率举措将实现我们所期望的效率，因此，毛利增长超过收入增长的驱动因素将会减速。
On the other hand, we believe that the mix shift to higher margin revenue streams is a phenomenon that has many years to run, and therefore we think that our gross profit will continue to increase faster than our revenue, but potentially at a 1.x times multiplier, rather than at a 2.x times multiplier looking forward. Thank you.
另一方面，我们认为向更高利润率收入来源的转变是一个将持续多年的现象，因此我们认为我们的毛利润将继续以比收入更快的速度增长，但未来可能以 1.x 倍的倍数增长，而不是以 2.x 倍的倍数增长。谢谢。
还可以再持续一段时间，成熟的大型科技企业都有这个能力，腾讯更有这个能力。
John Lo 约翰·洛
Yes, in terms of the share of profit of associates, on a non-GAAP basis, it increased from RMB3.9 billion a year ago to RMB9.9 billion due to contribution from associates like PDD and to a lesser extent, Kuaishou and Epic. As the share of associated profits started to pick up from quarter two 2023 and further accelerated in later quarters of 2023, due to the rule of large numbers, we expect that the year-on-year growth will reduce to a lower level in the second half of the year.
是的，在联营公司利润的份额方面，按非 GAAP 标准计算，去年为 39 亿元人民币，今年增加到 99 亿元人民币，这得益于拼多多等联营公司的贡献，以及快手和 Epic 的较小贡献。由于联营利润的份额从 2023 年第二季度开始回升，并在 2023 年后续季度进一步加速，基于大数法则，我们预计下半年的同比增长将降低到一个较低的水平。
持续性不强。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thank you. Next we will take the question from Ronald Keung from Goldman Sachs.
谢谢。接下来我们将接听来自高盛的 Ronald Keung 的问题。
Ronald Keung 罗纳德·邱
Thank you. Pony, Martin, James, John and Wendy. I want to ask two questions. One is on games that very big contrast versus last year. This year we're seeing your reacceleration in domestic, international games, your proactive adjusted evergreen existing games, launch of new titles and then strong Supercell grossing. So how are we planning ahead?
谢谢你。Pony、Martin、James、John 和 Wendy。我想问两个问题。一个是关于与去年相比差异很大的游戏。今年我们看到你们在国内和国际游戏上的重新加速，你们主动调整了常青的现有游戏，推出了新游戏，然后 Supercell 的收入也很强劲。那么我们如何进行前瞻性规划？
I think to smooth, maybe partially smooth, this hyper growth trends that we're seeing in the gross receipts momentum and for investors to see this into a sustained multi-year games revenue growth. Just looking at it from an overall portfolio basis, how do we want to manage and smooth this very strong trend that we're seeing recently?
我认为要平滑，可能部分平滑，我们在总收入势头中看到的这种超高速增长趋势，以便让投资者看到这种持续的多年游戏收入增长。从整体投资组合的角度来看，我们如何管理和平滑我们最近看到的这种非常强劲的趋势？
Second, on the investment portfolio, as we talked about, this will be a self-sustaining portfolio for the time being. What are the likely methods of divestments for mature -- more mature assets? Some may not be large enough to distribute, or some may not be that liquid to sell. How are we thinking on the methods of divestments and then what are the new areas of investment that we are working on? Thank you.
其次，关于投资组合，正如我们所讨论的，这将是一个暂时自给自足的投资组合。对于成熟资产，可能的剥离方法是什么？有些资产可能不够大而无法分配，或者有些资产可能流动性不足而无法出售。我们对剥离方法的思考是什么？我们正在研究哪些新的投资领域？谢谢。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
Hi, so, starting with the second question, if you look at the second quarter of this year, then our divestitures were substantially in excess of our gross new investments. So if you take divestitures plus dividends received plus fund distributions received, then that was over 50% greater than the capital we deployed in new investments. So the portfolio is indeed self-funding.
嗨，从第二个问题开始，如果你看看今年第二季度，我们的剥离大大超过了我们的新投资总额。因此，如果你将剥离、收到的股息和收到的基金分配相加，那么这超过了我们在新投资中投入的资本的 50%。所以投资组合确实是自我融资的。
In terms of our ability to conduct divestitures, then the majority of our portfolio value is in listed companies and much of it is in relatively large and liquid listed securities. And so in the second quarter we divested well over $1 billion by selling shares on the market. And I think that trend can continue.
在我们进行剥离的能力方面，我们的投资组合价值大部分在上市公司中，并且其中很多是在相对较大且流动性好的上市证券中。因此，在第二季度，我们通过在市场上出售股票剥离了超过 10 亿美元。我认为这一趋势可以继续下去。
相比于342 亿元人民币股票回购和 289 亿元人民币的 2023 年股息支付，这个数字是不大的。
On the first question about games, so we don't aspire to smooth out our game gross receipts growth necessarily. And from a reported perspective, our financial results smooth themselves out, because we defer the gross receipts into our profit and loss in some cases over the course of several years. And so that in and of itself exerts a naturally smoothing ability. But that's an accounting necessity. It's not a business choice on our part.
关于第一个问题，关于游戏，我们并不一定希望平滑我们的游戏总收入增长。从报告的角度来看，我们的财务结果自然会平滑，因为在某些情况下，我们将总收入延迟到我们的损益中，持续数年。因此，这本身就具有自然平滑的能力。但这是一种会计必要性，而不是我们业务上的选择。
But I think in terms of the underlying question behind your question, that we are experiencing a step up, because of Dungeon and Fighter Mobile, and so how do we sustain the underlying step up? I'd make a few points. One is that Dungeon and Fighter Mobile is one contributor. But we also had other contributors if we look purely at the China revenue then actually the launch of VALORANT in China contributed almost as much to our year-on-year revenue growth as the launch of DnF Mobile this quarter. So it's not DnF Mobile in isolation.
但我认为在你问题背后的根本问题上，我们正在经历一个提升，因为《地下城与勇士手游》。那么我们如何维持这种根本的提升呢？我想提出几点。首先，《地下城与勇士手游》是一个贡献者。但如果我们单纯看中国的收入，实际上《VALORANT》在中国的推出对我们同比收入增长的贡献几乎与本季度《地下城与勇士手游》的推出相当。因此，这并不是《地下城与勇士手游》单独的影响。
And then looking forward, we have the rebooting that we've done with two of our biggest games that we talked about yielding positive results this quarter, which we expect to continue yielding positive results going forward, is those two big games become more and more platform like, and the injection of new game modes such as Metro Royale or Extraction Shooter into those platforms drives further user and gross receipts growth.
然后展望未来，我们对我们谈到的两款最大游戏的重启取得了积极的结果，我们预计这种积极的结果将持续下去，这两款大游戏变得越来越像平台，而新游戏模式的注入，例如 Metro Royale 或 Extraction Shooter，推动了用户和总收入的进一步增长。
We have the ongoing growth that we've talked about in some of our newer evergreen games, such as League of Legends, Wild Rift we have -- and Fight of the Golden Spatula. Then of course we have a number of games in the pipeline that we're optimistic about, whether that's a Delta Force, Path of Exile 2 or One Piece that we believe have the potential to become evergreen games in their own right going forward as well. So that's how we think about driving continued growth for our game business over the long term.
我们在一些较新的常青游戏中谈到的持续增长仍在进行中，例如《英雄联盟》、《云顶之奕》和《金色铲子之战》。当然，我们还有一些我们充满信心的游戏在开发中，无论是《特种部队》、《流亡黯道 2》还是《海贼王》，我们相信它们都有潜力在未来成为各自的常青游戏。这就是我们如何看待推动游戏业务长期持续增长的方式。
Martin Lau 马丁·刘
Yes, I would just add to that and basically saying we did have a good quarter and the traction is actually quite nice. But let's not lose sight of the fact that we have -- you have seen very challenging business environment in the past couple of years. And that's really the nature of the gaming business, right, which is number one, it's increasingly difficult to come up with the very successful new titles these days because the quality of the games and the expectation of the gamers are very high.
是的，我只是想补充一下，基本上说我们确实有一个不错的季度，增长势头相当不错。但我们不能忽视过去几年中非常具有挑战性的商业环境。这确实是游戏行业的本质，对吧？首先，如今推出非常成功的新游戏越来越困难，因为游戏的质量和玩家的期望都非常高。
And at the same time, the quality and the franchise value of existing titles are very strong. So that if you want to launch a new game, you actually sort of, you have to come up with really good quality or very differentiated gameplay in order to attract users. And as such, we just need to work very hard to come up with good new titles.
同时，现有游戏的质量和品牌价值都非常强大。因此，如果你想推出一款新游戏，实际上你必须提供非常高的质量或非常有差异化的游戏玩法，以吸引用户。因此，我们需要非常努力地推出好的新游戏。
While at the same time, we do think that existing franchises are actually becoming more and more sustainable. But having said that, in order to grow existing franchises, we also have to keep on innovating. And as a result getting our users excited. And overall, I would say the gaming industry is still have got a lot of potential, but then it's to some extent cyclical because when there is a dearth in innovation or new supply or new excitement, then it seems to be in doldrums.
同时，我们确实认为现有的特许经营实际上变得越来越可持续。但话虽如此，为了发展现有的特许经营，我们还必须不断创新。因此，让我们的用户感到兴奋。总体而言，我会说游戏行业仍然有很大的潜力，但在某种程度上它是周期性的，因为当创新、新供应或新兴奋的缺乏时，它似乎就会陷入低迷。
时不时的处于被否定，被批判的处境，这跟影视明星的处境是相似的，是某种群体心理倾向的反应，是行业属性。
And then when there is a new wave of innovation, then the gaming business suddenly sort of -- and the industry expands, right? And we just have to continue to work very, very hard in order to drive innovation. And we felt if we can do that, we can actually grow this business over a longer period of time. But you know, ourselves as well as investors probably need to recognize that fact that there's going to be some cyclicality in the gaming business when there's smaller years, when there's less innovation then it grows less, when there's suddenly a big emergence of innovation, then it will grow faster.
然后，当出现新一波创新时，游戏业务突然就会——行业也会扩展，对吧？我们必须继续非常努力地推动创新。我们觉得如果能做到这一点，就能在更长的时间内发展这个业务。但你知道，我们自己以及投资者可能需要认识到，游戏业务会有一些周期性，当某些年份创新较少时，增长会较慢；而当突然出现大量创新时，增长会更快。
Ronald Keung 罗纳德·邱
Got it. Thank you, Martin and James.
明白了。谢谢你，马丁和詹姆斯。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thank you. We will take the next question from Ellie Jiang from Macquarie.
谢谢。我们将接下来的问题交给来自麦格理的 Ellie Jiang。
Ellie Jiang 艾莉·姜
Thank you so much, management, for taking my questions. I have two. Number one is really on the advertising segment. So second quarter we've delivered 19% growth, seemed much more resilient versus the prior expectations, especially considering in the opening remark management, you pointed out that the impact on the advertising pricing under the current environment. Just wondering what we have done differently both with Video Accounts and the other ad formats, and how we have observed the advertisers behaviors shift under the current dynamics and how we're planning to defend the macro volatilities?
非常感谢管理层回答我的问题。我有两个问题。第一个问题主要关于广告部门。第二季度我们实现了 19%的增长，似乎比之前的预期更具韧性，特别是考虑到在开场白中管理层提到的当前环境对广告定价的影响。我想知道我们在视频账户和其他广告格式上做了哪些不同的事情，以及我们如何观察到广告主在当前动态下的行为变化，以及我们计划如何应对宏观波动性？
The second one is really on the AI integration progress within our ecosystem. We already heard some exciting upgrades with the advertising segment. Just wondering if anything else you could share such as the large language model training progress, application explorations opportunities and how we plan to strategize to further bump up the efficiency adoption? Thank you.
第二个问题实际上是关于我们生态系统内的人工智能集成进展。我们已经听到了广告领域的一些令人兴奋的升级。想知道是否还有其他可以分享的内容，比如大语言模型的训练进展、应用探索机会，以及我们计划如何制定策略进一步提高效率的采用？谢谢。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
So I'll take the advertising question and we haven't made dramatic changes, we're just continuing to execute along our path. And we are benefiting from deployment of neural network artificial intelligence on a GPU infrastructure to boost the click-through rate on our advertising inventory. We are benefiting from mix shift of advertising within -- we’re seeing increasingly being of a closed loop nature. And all else equal, as you can see from the big e-commerce marketplaces and short video services, closed-loop advertising tends to achieve higher -- both higher CPM, but also higher click-through rate versus non-closed loop advertising.
所以我来回答广告的问题，我们没有做出戏剧性的变化，我们只是继续沿着我们的道路执行。我们正在利用在 GPU 基础设施上部署神经网络人工智能来提高我们广告库存的点击率。我们正在受益于广告的组合转变——我们看到越来越多的闭环性质。其他条件相同，正如您从大型电子商务市场和短视频服务中看到的，闭环广告往往能够实现更高的——不仅是更高的 CPM，还有更高的点击率，相较于非闭环广告。
And then we have the potential to benefit from releasing more inventory, especially in video accounts. But in reality, in the first-half of the year, we didn't release incremental inventories. So the growth that we experienced was more a function of the first two features.
然后我们有可能通过释放更多库存来获益，特别是在视频账户方面。但实际上，在上半年的时候，我们并没有释放增量库存。因此，我们所经历的增长更多是前两个特性的结果。
Martin Lau 马丁·刘
Well in terms of AI, I would say we look at AI as a more complete suite than just large language model. There are neural networks, machine-learning based recommendation engines, which we use for content recommendation, video recommendation as well as talking in the ads and content use case which is already delivering very good results. If you take Video Accounts as an example, by using AI, we actually are able to deliver better content and that generates more user time. A pretty big part of the growth in terms of the Video Accounts user time is actually driven by better targeting, better recommendation, and that's in turn driven by AI.
在人工智能方面，我认为我们将人工智能视为一个比大型语言模型更完整的套件。我们有神经网络、基于机器学习的推荐引擎，这些用于内容推荐、视频推荐，以及在广告和内容使用案例中的对话，这些已经取得了非常好的效果。如果以视频账户为例，通过使用人工智能，我们实际上能够提供更好的内容，从而生成更多的用户时间。在视频账户用户时间增长的很大一部分实际上是由更好的定位、更好的推荐驱动的，而这又是由人工智能推动的。
推荐引擎最好的适用场景是短视频。
And at the same time on the ads recommendation end, if we can actually increase conversion by 10%, right, that's sort of pretty modest improvement, then the revenue actually grows quite a bit, right. So I think that's areas in which we are leveraging AI to deliver material and tangible commercial results. In addition, in the area of games, we are actually using AI to bridge the gap between PvE and PvP, right. So when you have games which allow people to play against other players, but at the same time, sometimes you actually want to create a game mode in which a player actually play against the machine, right, then in the past, the machine is actually quite dumb, right.
同时，在广告推荐方面，如果我们能够实际提高 10%的转化率，这算是相当温和的改善，那么收入实际上会增长很多。因此，我认为这是我们利用人工智能来实现实质性和可衡量的商业成果的领域。此外，在游戏领域，我们实际上正在使用人工智能来弥合 PvE 和 PvP 之间的差距。因此，当你有允许人们与其他玩家对战的游戏时，有时你实际上想创建一个玩家与机器对战的游戏模式，而在过去，机器实际上是相当愚蠢的。
这是一个非常好的点，腾讯是非常好的标的。
And with AI, we can actually make the machine play like a real player, and we can actually sort of have it to play at varying levels of skills and make the user experience and the gameplay very fun. So I think those are the areas which are not LLM, but generating very tangible results for our businesses.
通过人工智能，我们实际上可以让机器像真实玩家一样进行游戏，并且可以让它在不同的技能水平上进行游戏，从而使用户体验和游戏玩法非常有趣。因此，我认为这些领域并不是LLM，但为我们的业务带来了非常切实的成果。
Now, in terms of LLM, the key thing for us is actually improving the technology. And as we shared before, we have already built an MoE architecture model which is performing as one of the top models in China. And when compared with international models on Chinese language, I think we're at the top of the pack. And we are deploying our LLM in Yuanbao, right, which is an app that we have launched, which allowed users to interact with our large language model in multiple ways. And one way is enhanced search functionality, so that users can actually ask a question. And based on search results, we can actually provide very direct answer to the questions that our users pose.
现在，就LLM而言，对我们来说关键的事情实际上是改善技术。正如我们之前分享的，我们已经构建了一个 MoE 架构模型，该模型在中国的表现位居前列。与国际模型在中文方面相比，我认为我们处于领先地位。我们正在 Yuanbao 中部署我们的LLM，对吧，这是我们推出的一款应用，允许用户以多种方式与我们的语言模型互动。其中一种方式是增强搜索功能，用户可以实际提出问题。根据搜索结果，我们可以为用户提出的问题提供非常直接的答案。
And we have rolled it out to large enough sample size to get user feedback. And the feedback so far has been quite positive. But of course, at the same time, we are also receiving a lot of constructive feedbacks, and then we're using that to keep improving our product as well as our model. And over time, Yuanbao, when it gets to a certain level of quality then we're going to increase our promotional resources and try to get more users into the app.
我们已经将其推广到足够大的样本量以获取用户反馈。目前的反馈相当积极。当然，与此同时，我们也收到了很多建设性的反馈，我们正在利用这些反馈不断改进我们的产品和模型。随着时间的推移，当元宝达到一定的质量水平时，我们将增加我们的推广资源，努力吸引更多用户使用该应用。
And at the same time when it gets to even better level of expertise, then we can actually start incorporating it into different parts of our ecosystem. We have a lot of apps, which actually has got interaction use cases, which can leverage our Generative AI technology and we would be incorporating our tool into those use cases at the time when the quality of our product is good, and at the same time as we continue to improve the efficiency of the model so that these products can be delivered to the users at a cost-effective way.
当它达到更高的专业水平时，我们实际上可以开始将其融入我们生态系统的不同部分。我们有很多应用程序，实际上有交互使用案例，可以利用我们的生成式人工智能技术，我们将在产品质量良好时将我们的工具融入这些使用案例，同时继续提高模型的效率，以便以具有成本效益的方式将这些产品交付给用户。
Ellie Jiang 艾莉·姜
Thank you very much.
非常感谢。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thank you. We will take the next question from Alex Yao from JP Morgan.
谢谢。我们将接下来的问题交给来自摩根大通的 Alex Yao。
Alex Yao 亚历克斯·姚
Thank you management for taking my question and congrats on a strong quarter. My first question is regarding DnF Mobile. The game has achieved a strong initial momentum since the launch in late May. How do you guys think about the sustainability of this game? I'm asking because this is not a typical tactical e-sports game such as Honor of Kings or Peacekeeper Elite, that we have a lot of expertise, domain knowledge and execution track records. So given the genre of nature of the game, what's the strategy and the outlook for the game's sustainability?
感谢管理层回答我的问题，并祝贺你们取得了强劲的季度业绩。我的第一个问题是关于《地下城与勇士》手游的。自 5 月底上线以来，这款游戏取得了强劲的初始势头。你们如何看待这款游戏的可持续性？我之所以问这个问题，是因为这并不是像《王者荣耀》或《和平精英》这样的典型战术电子竞技游戏，我们在这方面有很多专业知识、领域知识和执行记录。那么，考虑到这款游戏的类型特性，游戏的可持续性战略和前景是什么？
And then second question is regarding FinTech. The growth rate of the FinTech business was negatively affected by a slow consumption environment and also high price sensitivity among consumers. Have you observed the consumption behavior change in terms of financial product transaction on Weixin platform? If so, are these changes structural or cyclical? Thank you.
然后第二个问题是关于金融科技的。金融科技业务的增长率受到消费环境疲软和消费者价格敏感度高的负面影响。您是否观察到在微信平台上金融产品交易的消费行为变化？如果有，这些变化是结构性的还是周期性的？谢谢。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
Hi Alex, thank you. On Dungeon and Fighter Mobile, we are very optimistic about the sustainability. The first reason is that there is the Dungeon and Fighter PC game that has sustained at a high level, a very high level for 16-years. And so I think that we believe we do have expertise in operating this kind of game. We've done it for 16-years successfully with Dungeon and Fighter PC, and now we're extending it to a new platform.
嗨，亚历克斯，谢谢你。在《地下城与勇士手游》中，我们对其可持续性非常乐观。第一个原因是《地下城与勇士》PC 游戏在过去 16 年中一直保持在一个非常高的水平。因此，我认为我们确实在运营这种游戏方面拥有专业知识。我们已经成功运营《地下城与勇士》PC 版 16 年，现在我们将其扩展到一个新平台。
In a secondly, we can see that in the 60-odd days since launch, Dungeon and Fighter Mobile has a very good retention rates. And of course, retention rates can fluctuate over time. But actually the first 30-days of a game's life, those first 30-day retention rates are historically very good leading indicators for which games would enjoy the greatest longevity. And so, whether it's League of Legends or Teamfight Tactics, or Peacekeeper Elite, or Honor of Kings, what marked them out in their first 30-days was not how many users downloaded the games, was not how much revenue they generated, it was the high retention rates that they were displaying among those users, who had installed and begun playing the game. We're also seeing very good retention rates for DnF Mobile.
在发布后的 60 多天里，我们可以看到《地下城与勇士手游》的留存率非常好。当然，留存率会随着时间波动。但实际上，游戏生命周期的前 30 天，前 30 天的留存率在历史上是非常好的领先指标，能够预测哪些游戏会享有更长的寿命。因此，无论是《英雄联盟》还是《云顶之奕》，还是《和平精英》，或《王者荣耀》，它们在前 30 天的标志并不是有多少用户下载了游戏，也不是产生了多少收入，而是它们在那些已安装并开始玩游戏的用户中显示出的高留存率。我们也看到《地下城与勇士手游》的留存率非常好。
And of course, because the DnF Mobile game has been in development for an unusually long period, there's a very heavy content pipeline over the next two years to three years that's already set up, that will be progressively released. And of course, during those two years to three years, Nexon and we will be working on content pipeline for subsequent years. But the game is in an unusual situation where because if its unusually long development pipeline, there's now an unusually long post-release content pipeline that's already ready to release as and when we choose to do so. So that's on DnF Mobile.
当然，由于 DnF 移动游戏的开发周期异常漫长，接下来两到三年内已经建立了一个非常庞大的内容管道，将会逐步发布。当然，在这两到三年期间，Nexon 和我们将会为后续年份的内容管道进行工作。但该游戏处于一种不寻常的情况，因为其异常漫长的开发周期，现在已经有一个异常长的发布后内容管道，随时可以根据我们的选择进行发布。这就是关于 DnF 移动游戏的情况。
Martin Lau 马丁·刘
So on FinTech, if we dissect into different businesses, right? The payment business is definitely very tied to consumption growth. And as you can see in the official data, consumer consumption growth in China is actually kind of weak. And we also clearly see that in our payment business in the sense that we saw a continued growth in terms of the number of transactions. So the number of transactions on the commercial side continued to grow double-digit.
在金融科技方面，如果我们深入分析不同的业务，你会发现支付业务肯定与消费增长密切相关。正如你在官方数据中看到的，中国的消费增长实际上是相当疲软的。我们在自己的支付业务中也清楚地看到了这一点，也就是说，我们在交易数量上看到了持续的增长。商业方面的交易数量持续实现了两位数的增长。
But on the other hand, the average transaction value has decreased, which is contrary to before, in which we have seen pretty consistent growth in terms of average transaction value over a very long period of time. So we felt this is a clear demonstration of the fact that consumers are getting much more budget conscious. And so that's on the payment side.
但另一方面，平均交易价值已经下降，这与之前的情况相反，之前我们在很长一段时间内看到平均交易价值有相当稳定的增长。因此，我们认为这清楚地表明消费者变得更加注重预算。因此，这就是支付方面的情况。
In terms of the credit, we do see consumers actually wanting to borrow more at this point in time, but then the revenue actually decreased, because we proactively control the amount that we lend out and WeBank lend out, because we want to tighten the credit at this point in time when the macro and consumption is kind of weak.
在信贷方面，我们确实看到消费者在此时希望借更多的钱，但收入实际上减少了，因为我们主动控制了我们和微众银行的放贷金额，因为我们希望在宏观经济和消费相对疲软的情况下收紧信贷。
And on the other hand, wealth management actually increased, because a lot of consumers, instead of spending, they actually save more during uncertain times. So these are the dynamics that's happening across the different product areas within FinTech. We felt this is more cyclical rather than structural because it's somewhat tied to the weak consumption pattern that's happening in the overall market.
另一方面，财富管理实际上增加了，因为许多消费者在不确定时期选择储蓄而不是消费。因此，这些是金融科技不同产品领域中发生的动态。我们认为这更多是周期性的而非结构性的，因为它在某种程度上与整体市场中出现的消费疲软模式相关。
And as a result of that, we have seen the government actually rolling out very proactive policies to encourage consumption. And we felt with these rollouts of such policies, at some point in time the consumer sentiment as well as the economy will start turning. Because as evidenced in the wealth management service, it's not as like people don't have money. People actually sort of have money, but they choose to save rather to spend. And if the government policies can actually induce more confidence among the consumers and start revitalizing different parts of the economy that we felt at some point in time consumer sentiment would turn and that would be good for our FinTech business.
因此，我们看到政府实际上推出了非常积极的政策来鼓励消费。我们认为，随着这些政策的推出，在某个时刻，消费者信心和经济将开始好转。因为在财富管理服务中可以看出，并不是说人们没有钱。人们实际上是有钱的，但他们选择储蓄而不是消费。如果政府的政策能够真正增强消费者的信心，并开始振兴经济的不同部分，我们认为在某个时刻消费者信心会转变，这对我们的金融科技业务将是有利的。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thank you. Next we will take the question from Charlene Liu from HSBC.
谢谢。接下来我们将接听来自汇丰银行的 Charlene Liu 的问题。
Charlene Liu 刘查琳
Thank you very much. Martin mentioned that the bar for a game quality and expectations have only gone up and turned more demanding. Can management discuss where we are in the investment cycle for AAA titles? And can you please give us an update on latest progress and whatnot? That's the first question.
非常感谢。马丁提到游戏质量和期望的标准只会提高，变得更加苛刻。管理层能否讨论一下我们在 AAA 游戏投资周期中的位置？您能否给我们更新一下最新进展和其他相关信息？这是第一个问题。
And separately we have seen that cross-pollination of literature or existing PC games, IPs has played quite a vital role for driving growth in long-videos as well as for mobile games. Honor of King World is obviously a highly anticipated title. What is the progress there? And can management also discuss what other IPs in the reserve, would you expect to see similar potential in capable of driving more revenue potential across digital content segments. Thank you.
我们还看到，文学或现有 PC 游戏、知识产权的交叉传播在推动长视频和移动游戏的增长中发挥了重要作用。《王者荣耀》显然是一个备受期待的游戏。那里的进展如何？管理层能否讨论一下储备中还有哪些其他知识产权，您期望看到类似的潜力，以推动数字内容领域的更多收入潜力。谢谢。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
I think the second question we've talked about some of the other IP-based games that we're excited about earlier in this call and also at length at the fourth quarter results call. So I would refer back to that, but you can also look at what games we have that have become dramatically successful on PC, such as VALORANT, which is now the biggest PC game in China. And of course, we'd like to bring that to mobile. And that recently secured it's banhao or publishing license in China. And you can look, if you're so inclined, at some of the interesting IP being generated by China Literature and being generated by Tencent comics and speculators, whether that IP would make sense as the basis for games as well. So that's on the second question.
我认为我们在这通电话中讨论过的一些其他基于 IP 的游戏，以及在第四季度业绩电话中详细讨论的内容，都是第二个问题的相关内容。因此，我会回到那个话题，但你也可以看看我们在 PC 上取得显著成功的游戏，比如 VALORANT，它现在是中国最大的 PC 游戏。当然，我们希望将其带到移动平台。最近它在中国获得了版号或出版许可证。如果你有兴趣，可以看看中国文学和腾讯漫画所产生的一些有趣的 IP，以及这些 IP 是否也可以作为游戏的基础。这就是关于第二个问题的内容。
In terms of the first question, I'm not sure that there's a cycle per se in AAA game development. I think there's more of a relentless trend where the game industry is only becoming bigger, and therefore, the budgets associated with the best games are also only becoming bigger. And we need to play in that arena and that's what we're doing. And so we have been continually creating a large number of games as you know. We expense those costs through our P&L. We don't capitalize them. And so what you see is sort of what you get in terms of the income statement, tracking the cash flow quite closely. And we are indeed investing in a large number of what we believe will be very high-quality games.
关于第一个问题，我不确定在AAA级游戏开发中真的有一个周期性的东西。我认为更多的是一个无情的趋势，即游戏行业只会变得越来越大，因此，与最佳游戏相关的预算也只会变得越来越大。我们需要在这个领域中发挥作用，而这正是我们正在做的。所以我们一直在不断地创造大量的游戏，正如你所知道的。我们通过损益表来支出这些成本。我们不会将它们资本化。所以你看到的基本上是你在损益表上看到的，与现金流紧密跟踪。我们确实正在投资于大量我们认为将是非常高质的游戏。
科技企业的特点，跟保险业的浮存金相似，是现有财务报表不能反映的盈利能力，开发游戏的投入是费用，实际上应该是资本，这些钱没有消失，而是转成了能创造现金流的资本。
As to defining which ones in AAA versus which ones are more systems based, then I think the boundaries are becoming increasingly blurred. If you look at our game, Delta Force, that's now available for alpha testing on Steam and is quite popular. One of the reasons for the popularity is that within Delta Force, there's a mode that is very cinematic, classic AAA experience that's modeled on the Black Hawk Down incident. And then there's two other modes which are much more system-based, an extraction shooter mode and 30 versus 30 mode that are much more akin to some of our competitive PVP games. And so Delta Force is an example of something that incorporates both the cinematic AAA experience as well as the competitive PVP experience.
关于定义哪些是 AAA 游戏，哪些更偏向系统基础，我认为界限变得越来越模糊。如果你看看我们的游戏《Delta Force》，现在在 Steam 上可供 alpha 测试，并且相当受欢迎。受欢迎的原因之一是，在《Delta Force》中，有一个非常电影化的模式，经典的 AAA 体验，基于《黑鹰坠落》事件建模。还有另外两个模式则更偏向系统基础，一个是提取射击模式，另一个是 30 对 30 模式，更类似于我们的一些竞争性 PVP 游戏。因此，《Delta Force》是一个结合了电影化 AAA 体验和竞争性 PVP 体验的例子。
Martin Lau 马丁·刘
If I can add right now, I think AAA is more like means, not an end, right? So you can have a play mode driven game, you can have content-driven game, and AAA is probably more geared towards content driven. But I think for us, we really want to -- the ends is actually building game titles to become evergreen titles. And over time, building big enough evergreen titles into platforms. And within the platform, you would have -- you have play-mode driven content. You also have content-driven play mode. So it will be interlaced within a game, overall game world. So that's sort of what we felt will be happening.
如果我现在可以添加，我认为 AAA 更像是一种手段，而不是目的，对吧？所以你可以有一个以玩法为驱动的游戏，也可以有一个以内容为驱动的游戏，而 AAA 可能更倾向于以内容为驱动。但我认为对我们来说，我们真正想要的——最终目标实际上是构建游戏标题，使其成为常青标题。随着时间的推移，将足够大的常青标题构建成平台。在这个平台内，你会有——你有以玩法驱动的内容。你也有以内容驱动的玩法。因此，它将在一个游戏、整体游戏世界中交织在一起。这就是我们认为会发生的事情。
And we see a big opportunity in the future of course, it would take some time to develop, to put more content-driven playing experience into our competitive games. And we felt that, that could be a pretty good opportunity for us to get our users within our competitive games to be exciting. And over time with the advent of AI, as I said earlier, then when we can actually blur the line between PVP and PVE, then there's actually more opportunity for us along that.
我们看到未来有很大的机会，当然，这需要一些时间来开发，将更多以内容为驱动的游戏体验融入我们的竞技游戏中。我们觉得，这对我们来说是一个很好的机会，可以让我们的用户在竞技游戏中感到兴奋。随着时间的推移，随着人工智能的出现，正如我之前所说，当我们能够模糊 PVP 和 PVE 之间的界限时，我们实际上会有更多的机会。
Charlene Liu 刘查琳
Thank you. 谢谢。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thank you. We will take the next question from William Packer from BNP Paribas.
谢谢。我们将接下来的问题交给来自法国巴黎银行的威廉·帕克。
William Packer 威廉·帕克
Hi, management. Thanks for taking my question. There's been some press speculation around tensions with app store owners in China regarding several factors, for example, fees and external payment systems. This is parallel to what we're seeing in Europe and elsewhere. Could you help us think through the challenges and opportunities across the portfolio? For example, do you still see upside for the gaming business gross margin from reducing payments? Or in contrast, should we be more cautious for elements of the WeChat ecosystem? Any color appreciated. Thank you.
嗨，管理层。感谢您回答我的问题。关于中国与应用商店所有者之间的紧张关系，媒体有一些猜测，涉及多个因素，例如费用和外部支付系统。这与我们在欧洲和其他地方看到的情况相似。您能帮我们思考一下整个投资组合中的挑战和机遇吗？例如，您是否仍然看到通过减少支付来提高游戏业务毛利的潜力？或者，相反，我们是否应该对微信生态系统的某些元素更加谨慎？任何信息都很感激。谢谢。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
So that's quite a dense question. And my answer may or may not sort of reflect all of the density, but let me attempt to answer. So there are indeed naturally tensions between the game industry or the digital content industry versus app stores. And the root cause of the tensions is that the app stores charge what the game industry feels is a very onerous burden of 30% on games and other forms of digital content.
所以这是一个相当复杂的问题。我的回答可能无法完全反映所有的复杂性，但让我尝试回答。确实，游戏行业或数字内容行业与应用商店之间存在自然的紧张关系。这种紧张关系的根本原因在于，应用商店对游戏和其他形式的数字内容收取 30%的费用，这被游戏行业视为一种非常沉重的负担。
Of course, the app stores would argue that they provide a beneficial ecosystem that is supportive of this digital content. But then the game industry would reply that, that ecosystem, if it benefits digital content, also benefits all sorts of other goods and services. And so why is it the case that the burden of funding the ecosystem falls disproportionately entirely onto the digital content providers. And not at all onto all of the other goods and services providers who we could assist.
当然，应用商店会争辩说，他们提供了一个有利的生态系统，支持这些数字内容。但游戏行业会回应说，如果这个生态系统有利于数字内容，它也有利于各种其他商品和服务。那么，为什么资助这个生态系统的负担完全不成比例地落在数字内容提供者身上，而完全不落在我们可以支持的其他商品和服务提供者身上呢？
So I think that's the general backdrop. And over time, both for regulatory reasons and for business reasons, there is a trend towards the app store take rate reducing over time. In terms of our position, then as you're aware, for the Dungeon and Fighter Mobile game, given the strength of the IP, given the fact we knew that the most enthusiastic players will seek out the game and download it from URL, whether it's in an Android app store or not. We made the decision for that specific game to work mostly with internal channels rather than with the onerous Android app store channels.
所以我认为这就是一般背景。随着时间的推移，出于监管原因和商业原因，应用商店的抽成比例有减少的趋势。至于我们的立场，正如您所知，对于《地下城与勇士》手游，考虑到 IP 的强大，以及我们知道最热情的玩家会通过 URL 寻找并下载游戏，无论是在 Android 应用商店还是其他地方。我们决定针对这款特定游戏主要通过内部渠道而不是繁琐的 Android 应用商店渠道进行合作。
苹果已经开始强化自己的safari，APP是被严格控制的，通过浏览器访问也想纳入更严格的控制。
And we're very happy with that decision. It's beneficial for our returns. And I think it's fine in terms of user experience. But there will be other games we release in the future with different characteristics where we're seeking to build an audience from scratch, where we look forward to continuously cooperate with the App store operators.
我们对此决定非常满意。这对我们的回报是有益的。我认为在用户体验方面也没问题。但未来我们将发布其他具有不同特征的游戏，我们希望从零开始建立受众，并期待与应用商店运营商持续合作。
So that's in terms of new game releases. Your question, I think also was touching on some of the press commentary around Mini Games on iOS. I think there's been some misunderstandings there about the nature of the current situation, which is that today we don't monetize Mini Games on iOS through in app transactions. And I think it would be in our interests, in Apple's interests, but more so for the game developers and the user's interests if that monetization were made available. But we want to make it available on terms that we think are economically sustainable, and that are also fair.
所以这在新游戏发布方面。你的问题，我认为也涉及到关于 iOS 上迷你游戏的一些媒体评论。我认为在当前情况下存在一些误解，即今天我们并没有通过应用内交易来对 iOS 上的迷你游戏进行货币化。我认为如果能够实现这种货币化，对我们、苹果以及更重要的是对游戏开发者和用户的利益都是有利的。但我们希望以我们认为经济上可持续且公平的条件来实现这一点。
腾讯自己没有收费是个聪明的做法，但不一定能被苹果认可。
And so that's a discussion that's underway, and we hope that the discussion leads to a positive outcome, because it'll be a win, win, win. But in the event that the discussion doesn't progress, then the current status quo continues. In the event that the discussion does progress, then that's incremental revenue for us, incremental revenue for game developers, potentially incremental revenue for Apple, and certainly a better experience for Apple users.
因此，这是一场正在进行的讨论，我们希望这场讨论能带来积极的结果，因为这将是三赢的局面。但如果讨论没有进展，那么当前的现状将继续。如果讨论有所进展，那么这将为我们带来增量收入，为游戏开发者带来增量收入，可能还会为苹果带来增量收入，并且肯定会为苹果用户带来更好的体验。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thank you. We will take the next question from Thomas Chong from Jefferies.
谢谢。我们将接下来的问题交给来自 Jefferies 的 Thomas Chong。
Thomas Chong 汤姆斯·张
Hi, good evening. Thanks management for taking my question. My first question is about our cloud business. Given that, I think in the prepared remarks we talked about AI-related revenue from high computing infrastructure, model library service, and also our AI solution for enterprise. I just want to get some more color with regard to our cloud revenue. What are our thoughts about the contribution from AI going forward?
嗨，晚上好。感谢管理层回答我的问题。我的第一个问题是关于我们的云业务。考虑到这一点，我认为在准备的发言中我们谈到了来自高计算基础设施、模型库服务以及我们企业的 AI 解决方案的 AI 相关收入。我只是想进一步了解我们云收入的情况。我们对未来 AI 的贡献有什么看法？
And my second question is about capital return. Considering the macro uncertainties these days, any thoughts about upsizing our share repurchase program? Thank you.
我的第二个问题是关于资本回报的。考虑到目前的宏观不确定性，您对扩大我们的股票回购计划有什么看法？谢谢。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
So on the first question, clearly for the U.S. hyperscale cloud providers, renting out GPUs to other companies with AI requirements has become a very big business. In China, the same trend is evident, but to a lesser extent. To a lesser extent, because you don't have the same multitude of extremely well-funded startups trying to build large language models on their own. In China, there are many small companies, but they're capitalized at a $1 billion, $2 billion. They're not capitalized at $10 billion or $90 billion, by the way, that some of the giant U.S. VC-funded startups are now capitalized in the space. And it's also a somewhat challenging economic environment.
在第一个问题上，显然对于美国的超大规模云服务提供商来说，向其他有人工智能需求的公司出租 GPU 已经成为一项非常大的业务。在中国，同样的趋势也很明显，但程度较轻。程度较轻是因为没有那么多资金雄厚的初创公司试图独立构建大型语言模型。在中国，有许多小公司，但它们的估值在 10 亿美元、20 亿美元之间。顺便提一下，它们的估值并没有达到 100 亿美元或 900 亿美元，而一些巨大的美国风险投资支持的初创公司在这个领域的估值已经达到了这个水平。此外，经济环境也相对具有挑战性。
Now that said, we have seen that within our cloud, the demand from customers for renting GPUs for their own AI needs has been growing very swiftly. The percentage growth rates are very fast, but they're very fast partly, because it's a low base and also partly, because while some of that demand for renting GPUs in the cloud is incremental, some of it is replacing demands that would otherwise have existed anyway for renting CPUs in the cloud. And so while the business of GPU provision is doing very well, the business of CPU processing is more flat because the incremental demand is for GPU, not CPU.
现在我们看到，在我们的云中，客户对租用 GPU 以满足自身 AI 需求的需求正在迅速增长。增长率非常快，但部分原因是基数较低，另外部分原因是，虽然云中对租用 GPU 的需求有些是增量的，但其中一些是替代了本来会存在的对租用 CPU 的需求。因此，尽管 GPU 提供业务表现良好，但 CPU 处理业务则相对平稳，因为增量需求是针对 GPU，而不是 CPU。
Martin Lau 马丁·刘
In terms of share buyback, at this point in time, we are continuing with our previously communicated share buyback program, and there's no update for now.
在股票回购方面，目前我们仍在继续之前沟通的股票回购计划，目前没有更新。
Thomas Chong 汤姆斯·张
Thank you. 谢谢。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thomas. We will take the last question from Gary Yu from Morgan Stanley.
托马斯。我们将从摩根士丹利的加里·余那里提最后一个问题。
Gary Yu
Hi, thank you for the opportunity to ask questions. My first question is regarding domestic games. Again a follow-up on DnF, I think management mentioned that we expect this to be the next evergreen major hit. How should we look at the longevity and scale on a sustainable basis versus the other two evergreen games in terms of amount of DAU or revenue potential in a kind of longer-term relative to Honor of Kings and Peacekeeper Elites?
嗨，感谢您提供提问的机会。我的第一个问题是关于国内游戏的。再次跟进一下《地下城与勇士》，我认为管理层提到我们期望这款游戏成为下一个常青的重大成功。我们应该如何看待其在可持续基础上的持久性和规模，与《王者荣耀》和《和平精英》这两款常青游戏在 DAU 或收入潜力方面的长期相对比较？
And my second question is related to macro, I think management indicated that we have started to see some negative impact on payment. How has the recent trend been looking like? So have we seen a stabilized trend or things are getting worse? And also we noticed that games and Tencent own ad property seems to be very resilient under this kind of macro environment. How sustainable do we think we can keep up the current resiliency in the games and advertising business in particular? Thank you.
我的第二个问题与宏观经济有关，我认为管理层表示我们已经开始看到支付方面的一些负面影响。最近的趋势看起来如何？我们是否看到了稳定的趋势，还是情况在恶化？我们还注意到，在这种宏观环境下，游戏和腾讯自有广告资产似乎非常有韧性。我们认为在游戏和广告业务中，当前的韧性能持续多久？谢谢。
James Mitchell 詹姆斯·米切尔
Hi Gary, on Dungeon and Fighter Mobile and triangulating it versus historically two biggest games, as well as other games that are in the market, then this is probably stating the obvious. So I apologize. But as a narrative rather than systems-based game, you know, one would naturally expect, you know, a lower daily active user base for DnF Mobile than one would for more systems-based games such as Honor of Kings or Peacekeeper Elite. On the other hand, as a narrative, not system-based games, one would expect a substantially higher ARPU for Dungeon and Fighter Mobile than for those system-based games.
嗨，Gary，关于《地下城与勇士手游》以及与历史上两个最大的游戏进行对比，还有市场上的其他游戏，这可能是显而易见的。所以我很抱歉。但作为一个叙事性而非系统性游戏，你知道，人们自然会期望《地下城与勇士手游》的日活跃用户数低于《王者荣耀》或《和平精英》等更系统化的游戏。另一方面，作为叙事性而非系统性游戏，人们会期望《地下城与勇士手游》的每用户平均收入（ARPU）显著高于那些系统性游戏。
In addition, because Dungeon and Fighter Mobile is sort of building on 16-years of legacy and specifically of many people who played Dungeon and Fighter PC 16-years ago when they were in college and now working and quite affluent, but only have time to play games on mobile phones, the spending power of those users is also greater than it would be for new games that appeal to more of a 20 something user base. And so, both the nature of the game being more narrative based as well as the nature of the audience being a more mature audience are conducive to higher ARPU.
此外，由于《地下城与勇士手游》在 16 年的传统基础上发展，特别是许多 16 年前在大学时玩过《地下城与勇士 PC》的玩家，现在已经工作并且相对富裕，但只有时间在手机上玩游戏，这些用户的消费能力也比那些更吸引 20 多岁用户的新游戏要强。因此，游戏的叙事性以及受众的成熟性都促进了更高的 ARPU。
Now that said, if you compare Dungeon and Fighter Mobile with other narrative-based games in the China market, then the user base, the number of DAUs, is dramatically larger. The game actually has a big audience for a narrative-based experience. And we believe that will continue given the nature of the game, given the high retention rates I talked about earlier. And while the ARPU is higher than it is for our biggest systems-based games, it's lower than for many narrative-based games in China. We think the monetization is fair and sustainable, again especially in light of the nature of the audience for Dungeon and Fighter Mobile.
现在，如果将《地下城与勇士手游》与中国市场上的其他叙事类游戏进行比较，那么用户基础，即日活跃用户数，显著更大。该游戏实际上在叙事体验方面拥有庞大的受众。我们相信，考虑到游戏的性质以及我之前提到的高留存率，这种情况将会持续。虽然每用户平均收入（ARPU）高于我们最大的系统类游戏，但低于中国许多叙事类游戏。我们认为这种货币化是公平且可持续的，尤其是考虑到《地下城与勇士手游》受众的性质。
Martin Lau 马丁·刘
In terms of macro, I would say what we saw is actually pretty consistent with the official consumption number, which is -- the second quarter is actually a slowdown from the first quarter. So I think that's the current trend we felt with the government rolling out more proactive policies and more expansionary policies than over time, given the resilience of the overall industry, as well as entrepreneurial environment in China, then we should over time see recovery in terms of the economy as well as consumer consumption. So that's what we believe in. But you know, whether at what time -- it's not a matter of whether, it's a matter of when. And we just sort of have to wait a little bit to see when the inducive policies would actually start yielding results.
从宏观角度来看，我认为我们看到的实际上与官方消费数字相当一致，即第二季度实际上是相较于第一季度的放缓。因此，我认为这是我们感受到的当前趋势，考虑到政府推出了比以往更积极的政策和更扩张性的政策，加上整体行业的韧性以及中国的创业环境，随着时间的推移，我们应该会看到经济和消费者消费的复苏。这就是我们的信念。但是，你知道，何时发生——这不是一个是否的问题，而是一个何时的问题。我们只需稍等一下，看看刺激政策何时会开始产生效果。
Now, in terms of games, I would say for our games, which are essentially large DAU, long engagement games, we have pretty low spending per unit of time. And as a result, we felt this is actually quite resilient in the overall macro environment. And if we are to see any issue, it probably will be in the low DAU, high ARPU games, which are not necessarily Tencent Games. And you might want to look at those games as proxies.
现在，就游戏而言，我会说我们的游戏本质上是大型日活跃用户（DAU）、长时间参与的游戏，我们每单位时间的支出相对较低。因此，我们认为这在整体宏观环境中实际上是相当有韧性的。如果我们看到任何问题，可能会出现在低 DAU、高每用户平均收入（ARPU）的游戏中，这些游戏不一定是腾讯游戏。您可能想将这些游戏视为代理。
游戏领域同样有消费降级。
And overall, we felt, of course part of the gaming industry is actually driven by macro environments which without given sort of the low spending per unit time, there probably is still some headroom before we hit that. The more important driver is actually innovation, as I've continually repeated a couple of times. So when there is continued innovation in the gaming industry, then we felt the market would expand, even if the macro environment is actually challenging.
总体而言，我们认为，当然，游戏行业的一部分实际上是受到宏观环境的驱动的，如果没有给定的单位时间低消费，可能在我们达到那个之前仍然有一些空间。更重要的驱动因素实际上是创新，正如我已经多次重复的那样。因此，当游戏行业持续创新时，我们认为市场会扩展，即使宏观环境实际上具有挑战性。
Wendy Huang 黄文迪
Thank you, Martin. We are now ending the webinar. Thank you all for joining our results today. If you wish to check out our press release and other financial information, please visit the IR section of our company website at www.tencent.com. The replay of this webinar will also be available soon. Thank you and see you next quarter.
谢谢你，马丁。我们现在结束网络研讨会。感谢大家今天参加我们的结果发布。如果您想查看我们的新闻稿和其他财务信息，请访问我们公司网站的投资者关系部分 www.tencent.com。此次网络研讨会的重播也将很快提供。谢谢，下一季度再见。
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